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> How raw is raw? Certainly no jpeg image produced by any digital camera is really “raw” as it will already have been through a debayering filter https://en.w

> How raw is raw? Certainly no jpeg image produced by any digital camera is really “raw” as it will already have been through a debayering filter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayer_filter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayer_filter And then on top of that is the JPEG compression artifacts. But I do wonder how many raw files also contain data that has been debayered already. I have not looked into that. I know that with third party firmware such as Magic Lantern it is possible to get the image data without debayering. https://magiclantern.fm/ https://magiclantern.fm/ Likewise I know that the Camera Module 3 for Raspberry Pi is possible to retrieve the image data from without debayering.

morphicpro 3y ago
[flagged]
sudosysgen 3y ago
The RAW data for the vast majority of MILCs and DSLRs is pre-debayering.
- userbinator 3y ago
  Even Android smartphones will give pre-debayering raw data from the sensor if you use the appropriate camera app. (There are quite a few cheap ones where the OEM debayering filter is just horrible, and the sensor is actually capable of much better quality.)
Wowfunhappy 3y ago
I feel like there's a meaningful difference between that stuff and the computational photography common on smartphones.
- astrange 3y ago
  There may be a meaningful difference between demosaicing and generative AI - actually there isn't because demosaicing/upscaling/image generation are all the same problem, but there might be one since people like to think of them as different. There isn't a difference between auto white balance and generative AI though. The colors in an auto mode digital camera picture are not real.
  - robocat 3y ago
    You can only get real colours in a raw format digital picture.
    - frostburg 3y ago
      Not really. First of all the colours aren't "real" even in that raw, and second if you accept that as real, you can get per-pixel chroma information with Foveon sensors, pixel-shift systems, monochrome sensors with lens filters...
      - astrange 3y ago
        Well, a more fundamental issue is that the colors of an object in a scene aren't "real" if the lighting in the scene is not daylight white. And most of the time you're not there to appreciate the low-CRI yellow indoor lights.

morphicpro 3y ago

[flagged]

sudosysgen 3y ago

The RAW data for the vast majority of MILCs and DSLRs is pre-debayering.

userbinator 3y ago
Even Android smartphones will give pre-debayering raw data from the sensor if you use the appropriate camera app. (There are quite a few cheap ones where the OEM debayering filter is just horrible, and the sensor is actually capable of much better quality.)

Wowfunhappy 3y ago

I feel like there's a meaningful difference between that stuff and the computational photography common on smartphones.

astrange 3y ago
There may be a meaningful difference between demosaicing and generative AI - actually there isn't because demosaicing/upscaling/image generation are all the same problem, but there might be one since people like to think of them as different. There isn't a difference between auto white balance and generative AI though. The colors in an auto mode digital camera picture are not real.
- robocat 3y ago
  You can only get real colours in a raw format digital picture.
  - frostburg 3y ago
    Not really. First of all the colours aren't "real" even in that raw, and second if you accept that as real, you can get per-pixel chroma information with Foveon sensors, pixel-shift systems, monochrome sensors with lens filters...
    - astrange 3y ago
      Well, a more fundamental issue is that the colors of an object in a scene aren't "real" if the lighting in the scene is not daylight white. And most of the time you're not there to appreciate the low-CRI yellow indoor lights.