6 ms·

Google HR hounds threaten 'next steps' for slackers not coming in 3 days a week

43 points by LinuxBender 3y ago

xrd 3y ago
When I read this I thought that some clever engineer is going to start an external web app to rotate badges around to volunteers who can scan them intermittently to make it look like they are in the office. Then I realized that Google is all in with AI and probably has cameras everywhere on campus. All that investment will pay off and permit Google to really see who came in and who handed their badge to a mule. I expect that there will be incredible breakthroughs in disguises that, in the end, will allow employees to fake their own commute. It'll be an epic battle and perhaps there will be a Marvel movie made out of those superheroes and villains.
- emodendroket 3y ago
  I mean, even without all the fancy AI detection doing something like that is obviously grounds for termination.
- GuB-42 3y ago
  They don't need fancy AI and all that. At some point someone will realize that there is a discrepancy between who badged and who is actually there, that 3 people badged and only one crossed the door, or maybe an employee will be caught red handed by a security guard. It will be treated as a serious security incident. Slacking off may be tolerable if the slackers otherwise bring value to the company, handing out one's badge, potentially letting unauthorized people in is something else. It will result in people getting fired on the spot, maybe even lawsuits. Engineers doing that would be anything but clever. And the "epic battle" will most likely be hopelessly one-sided and the movie will be about a bunch of people struggling to find a new job. If you don't want to commute, just stay at home, make up all the excuses you want, but don't play shenanigans with badges. If you bring enough value for the company despite "slacking off", you will get a pass, but if you mess with security, you won't.
- medler 3y ago
  No one is going to risk getting fired to make it look like their colleague was in the office.
  - xrd 3y ago
    I was joking with my statements. But, maybe Google has entered another realm where the tension between employer and employees is going to shift permanently. And then, who knows? It's a company of hackers, or at least it was long ago.
alephxyz 3y ago
> We've _heard_ from Googlers that those who spend at least three days a week in the office _feel_ more connected to other Googlers, and that this effect is magnified when teammates work from the same location," As an employee or an investor I would not want any of my CXOs to make major decisions based on hearsay and feelings, but it's guess it's different for WFH.
- llamaboy 3y ago
  Don’t forget the confirmation bias too! Who would have thought the people that go to the office think going to the office is good?!? Perhaps ask the remote workers how connected they feel…
- hakfoo 3y ago
  I also love the self-selected aspect. "The people who did X say positive things about X." There are scenarios where WFH is an excellent away around socially awkward scenarios. If the guy in the next cubicle makes things subtly uncomfortable-- maybe you don't like his cologne, maybe he's just a little too friendly-- being able to just bail and limit your exposure to scheduled meetings in a videochat box can be a huge win. Or conversely, I'd expect WFH to appeal to many people with social anxiety issues and autism-spectrum conditions, as again, you can just exit an environment that makes you uncomfortable on a daily basis. I'd also be interested to see how many on-premise perks they rolled back when nobody was in-office to claim them. That's a completely quantifiable number-- for the sake of "bringing people back to the office", you have to pay for a lot more catered lunches, probably way more claims for child care subsidies and transport reimbursements.
- emodendroket 3y ago
  It's pointless reading the justifications since they're obvious post hoc rationalizations.
- LinuxBender 3y ago
  Just a theory but I would guess that investors are probably interested in the bottom line which may be impacted by tax incentives or lack thereof for having their multi-million dollar investments into buildings occupied by {n}% of staff for {y}% of the year. I don't have anything to back this up, just vague memories of articles discussing the effect Covid-19 had on real estate. I believe there have also been real estate crashes predicted for large office buildings which could lead investors to hold on for dear life and double-down on utilizing the buildings for a few years. Otherwise people could just try to get out of contracts, write-down losses and sell their buildings fully embracing WFH.
slavapestov 3y ago
> The offices for Google Cloud were described as a "ghost town" by Alphabet and Google CEO Sundar Pichai in March, which he said some employees had complained about. "It's not a nice experience." So the office people were unhappy with other people not coming in to the office, and now they get hotdesking which is being spun as a perk?
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  “Noble people upset unable to hold court with the peasants.”
ITB 3y ago
Google has the right to do this. Employees have the right to quit. It’s okay to want your team to be an actual team and not just a group of people getting paid by the same employer. Team building works better in person. Just because some aspects of it are inconvenient, it doesn’t make it not true. The fact that commuting sucks doesn’t remove the fact that in person interactions are important. I suspect that at a fundamental level most people here know in-person adds an important quality that is missing otherwise.
- dmitrygr 3y ago
  “I suspect that” = “I have no quantifiable evidence that”
  - mvdtnz 3y ago
    This is a discussion forum. Opinions are welcome here.
    - beezlewax 3y ago
      So are facts and hard data proving one thing is better than the other. Most of us here are engineers of some description. I don't need some promotion-hunting manager obsessed with "optimizing team building" to micromanage how I work.
      - whywhywhywhy 3y ago
        No one is forcing you to work at a company that requires WFO so why does it matter.
        beezlewax 3y ago
        Of course they're not. But when the conditions in my work are looking likely to change I'm going to want to know why. It's not much of an ask for these things to actually make sense when they effect our quality of life.
- 3y ago
sacnoradhq 3y ago
PSA: If you currently work at Google, please go Xoogle for your own sanity. Google is a toxic environment.

43 points by LinuxBender 3y ago

xrd 3y ago

When I read this I thought that some clever engineer is going to start an external web app to rotate badges around to volunteers who can scan them intermittently to make it look like they are in the office. Then I realized that Google is all in with AI and probably has cameras everywhere on campus. All that investment will pay off and permit Google to really see who came in and who handed their badge to a mule. I expect that there will be incredible breakthroughs in disguises that, in the end, will allow employees to fake their own commute. It'll be an epic battle and perhaps there will be a Marvel movie made out of those superheroes and villains.

emodendroket 3y ago
I mean, even without all the fancy AI detection doing something like that is obviously grounds for termination.
GuB-42 3y ago
They don't need fancy AI and all that. At some point someone will realize that there is a discrepancy between who badged and who is actually there, that 3 people badged and only one crossed the door, or maybe an employee will be caught red handed by a security guard. It will be treated as a serious security incident. Slacking off may be tolerable if the slackers otherwise bring value to the company, handing out one's badge, potentially letting unauthorized people in is something else. It will result in people getting fired on the spot, maybe even lawsuits. Engineers doing that would be anything but clever. And the "epic battle" will most likely be hopelessly one-sided and the movie will be about a bunch of people struggling to find a new job. If you don't want to commute, just stay at home, make up all the excuses you want, but don't play shenanigans with badges. If you bring enough value for the company despite "slacking off", you will get a pass, but if you mess with security, you won't.
medler 3y ago
No one is going to risk getting fired to make it look like their colleague was in the office.
- xrd 3y ago
  I was joking with my statements. But, maybe Google has entered another realm where the tension between employer and employees is going to shift permanently. And then, who knows? It's a company of hackers, or at least it was long ago.

alephxyz 3y ago

> We've _heard_ from Googlers that those who spend at least three days a week in the office _feel_ more connected to other Googlers, and that this effect is magnified when teammates work from the same location," As an employee or an investor I would not want any of my CXOs to make major decisions based on hearsay and feelings, but it's guess it's different for WFH.

llamaboy 3y ago
Don’t forget the confirmation bias too! Who would have thought the people that go to the office think going to the office is good?!? Perhaps ask the remote workers how connected they feel…
hakfoo 3y ago
I also love the self-selected aspect. "The people who did X say positive things about X." There are scenarios where WFH is an excellent away around socially awkward scenarios. If the guy in the next cubicle makes things subtly uncomfortable-- maybe you don't like his cologne, maybe he's just a little too friendly-- being able to just bail and limit your exposure to scheduled meetings in a videochat box can be a huge win. Or conversely, I'd expect WFH to appeal to many people with social anxiety issues and autism-spectrum conditions, as again, you can just exit an environment that makes you uncomfortable on a daily basis. I'd also be interested to see how many on-premise perks they rolled back when nobody was in-office to claim them. That's a completely quantifiable number-- for the sake of "bringing people back to the office", you have to pay for a lot more catered lunches, probably way more claims for child care subsidies and transport reimbursements.
emodendroket 3y ago
It's pointless reading the justifications since they're obvious post hoc rationalizations.
LinuxBender 3y ago
Just a theory but I would guess that investors are probably interested in the bottom line which may be impacted by tax incentives or lack thereof for having their multi-million dollar investments into buildings occupied by {n}% of staff for {y}% of the year. I don't have anything to back this up, just vague memories of articles discussing the effect Covid-19 had on real estate. I believe there have also been real estate crashes predicted for large office buildings which could lead investors to hold on for dear life and double-down on utilizing the buildings for a few years. Otherwise people could just try to get out of contracts, write-down losses and sell their buildings fully embracing WFH.

slavapestov 3y ago

> The offices for Google Cloud were described as a "ghost town" by Alphabet and Google CEO Sundar Pichai in March, which he said some employees had complained about. "It's not a nice experience." So the office people were unhappy with other people not coming in to the office, and now they get hotdesking which is being spun as a perk?

toomuchtodo 3y ago
“Noble people upset unable to hold court with the peasants.”

ITB 3y ago

Google has the right to do this. Employees have the right to quit. It’s okay to want your team to be an actual team and not just a group of people getting paid by the same employer. Team building works better in person. Just because some aspects of it are inconvenient, it doesn’t make it not true. The fact that commuting sucks doesn’t remove the fact that in person interactions are important. I suspect that at a fundamental level most people here know in-person adds an important quality that is missing otherwise.

dmitrygr 3y ago
“I suspect that” = “I have no quantifiable evidence that”
- mvdtnz 3y ago
  This is a discussion forum. Opinions are welcome here.
  - beezlewax 3y ago
    So are facts and hard data proving one thing is better than the other. Most of us here are engineers of some description. I don't need some promotion-hunting manager obsessed with "optimizing team building" to micromanage how I work.
    - whywhywhywhy 3y ago
      No one is forcing you to work at a company that requires WFO so why does it matter.
      - beezlewax 3y ago
        Of course they're not. But when the conditions in my work are looking likely to change I'm going to want to know why. It's not much of an ask for these things to actually make sense when they effect our quality of life.
3y ago

sacnoradhq 3y ago

PSA: If you currently work at Google, please go Xoogle for your own sanity. Google is a toxic environment.