28 ms·

tildes.net feels like a better potential alternative to reddit. People have been raising privacy issue with lemmy.

by slashtab 3y ago

unshavedyak 3y ago
Can you link/describe detail on the privacy issues with Lemmy?
- slashtab 3y ago
  https://raddle.me/f/lobby/155371/warning-lemmy-doesn-t-care-about-your-privacy-everything-is https://raddle.me/f/lobby/155371/warning-lemmy-doesn-t-care-...
  - unshavedyak 3y ago
    Appreciate it! Shame. Kinda makes me want to fork Lemmy, because i like the tech stack more behind it lol. Hard to say if i'd like the source without looking, tho
    - unshavedyak 3y ago
      Small update, this is giving me the excuse i needed to look into ActivityPub. I'm rolling my own implementation from the ground up, though more as an exploration into ActivityPub and to experiment with UX. I realized the beauty here is that i don't need to replace Lemmy, Kbin, etc. I can lean into them, and even if i don't gain traction (i probably don't want it anyway. Managing large projects are unfun), i still get to be part of the larger ecosystem. Ie, why write a Client to Lemmy as you might with Reddit, when you can instead write a participating Server which also serves as a Client. Federation is neat like that. Though i'm still unclear on a lot of steps with federation, so we'll see how this goes.
  - aaomidi 3y ago
    All of these are a problem with Reddit today. everything on Reddit gets archived near instantly. I don’t think expecting deletion to work on public forums online is reasonable.
    - unshavedyak 3y ago
      Agreed. Though the political opinions of the core owner (?) might be problematic for project growth. For federated APIs though i tend not to think Privacy exists. "Delete me" is nice, but when it's already broadcasted to dozens of other instances it feels a bit moot. Still, worth doing right if you're going to do it at all - not sure why an instance owner would want to host everything indefinitely anyway. Storage concerns and all. This whole conversation is making me want to take the plunge and check out ActivityPub. "It can't be that hard" lol, right? Queue the narrator: "It was that hard".
      - faangsticle 3y ago
        The thing is that if they want to operate in the EU then this will have to be solved. The right to be forgotten exists, and saying "it's federated lol" is not an excuse.
        unshavedyak 3y ago
        Sidenote, i wonder if EU requires you keep some information about a user. Ie hypothetically, given some arbitrary P2P setup, you might need to record users that need to be forgotten, any aliases they fall under, etc. Lest you risk publishing said "forgotten" content from another source that is broadcasting. Worse yet if this publication is in a slightly tweaked format that your software doesn't recognize.
    - slashtab 3y ago
      [dead]
  - 2Gkashmiri 3y ago
    > Since the operator and developer of lemmy has very problematic politics (defending genocide and homophobia for example), and is demonstrably incredibly hostile to non-authoritarians, giving him permanent access to your data (even if you delete your account) is a very bad idea. this is talking about the developer of an AGPL 3.0 licensed software. WHAT HAS THE DEVELOPERS politics or for that matter, anything got to do with selfhosting lemmy ? isn't this problem with google or facebook yet no one seems to care about that but oh my god, its lemmy. also, what operator is this talking about in particular because lemmy is a FEDERATED SOFTWARE. there are hundreds of active servers
    - jasonm23 3y ago
      Could you provide links to references and sources for Lemmy's operator doing these things, so we are not just consuming heresay. I would really appreciate it.
      - 2Gkashmiri 3y ago
        i...... was making fun of the OP who wrote the above comment.
class4behavior 3y ago
Decentralization is what both public and private social media needs, which tildes does not offer; but Lemmy specifically is not the long-term answer to Reddit either. Still, that's irrelevant because mobility is one of the main purposes of the fediverse. That is, move to Lemmy or something else like kbin, yet, you're connected and may move again later on. Transferring of one's own content is still an open issue, though. Besides, while tildes incorporates a lot of the lessons mods learned already after the first half a dozen years of Reddit, it is not meant to scale. It's a platform for small/medium instances, not very large ones. It's a pity, though, there is so little support for decentralization/federation just because its design is a bigger challenge. Another reason is, however, the absence of a constitutional protection of one's privacy outside one's own property. Because of that the consumers of the dominating nation in that market don't really grasp nor care about that aspect.
- kvetching 3y ago
  how does content moderation occur with a fully decentralized network? Do they have a democratic type system whereby you can vote to have things removed? I'm thinking about some sort of PI being exposed or illicit media.
luuurker 3y ago
Tildes doesn't feel like a reddit replacement. There are limited "subs", "nsfw" content or discussions aren't allowed, has been invite-only for years, etc. I don't know if Lemmy is a good alternative either.
- satvikpendem 3y ago
  It's more of an HN replacement (or addition) where you can get pretty detailed posts and comments without jokes and memes. It's like if HN added subs for games, hobbies, etc.
- EA-3167 3y ago
  I've heard some pretty sketchy stories about Tildes moderation unfortunately, people being permabanned for obscure reasons within days of signing up for example. If that's where they're starting from, I'm not sure I want to see where they're going.
stiltzkin 3y ago
Tildes has stated they are not looking to be a Reddit alternative. They want to be narrow and deep in conversation so no images posts and porn. Also Reddit and HN has privacy issues.

tildes.net feels like a better potential alternative to reddit. People have been raising privacy issue with lemmy.

unshavedyak 3y ago

Can you link/describe detail on the privacy issues with Lemmy?

slashtab 3y ago
https://raddle.me/f/lobby/155371/warning-lemmy-doesn-t-care-about-your-privacy-everything-is https://raddle.me/f/lobby/155371/warning-lemmy-doesn-t-care-...
- unshavedyak 3y ago
  Appreciate it! Shame. Kinda makes me want to fork Lemmy, because i like the tech stack more behind it lol. Hard to say if i'd like the source without looking, tho
  - unshavedyak 3y ago
    Small update, this is giving me the excuse i needed to look into ActivityPub. I'm rolling my own implementation from the ground up, though more as an exploration into ActivityPub and to experiment with UX. I realized the beauty here is that i don't need to replace Lemmy, Kbin, etc. I can lean into them, and even if i don't gain traction (i probably don't want it anyway. Managing large projects are unfun), i still get to be part of the larger ecosystem. Ie, why write a Client to Lemmy as you might with Reddit, when you can instead write a participating Server which also serves as a Client. Federation is neat like that. Though i'm still unclear on a lot of steps with federation, so we'll see how this goes.
- aaomidi 3y ago
  All of these are a problem with Reddit today. everything on Reddit gets archived near instantly. I don’t think expecting deletion to work on public forums online is reasonable.
  - unshavedyak 3y ago
    Agreed. Though the political opinions of the core owner (?) might be problematic for project growth. For federated APIs though i tend not to think Privacy exists. "Delete me" is nice, but when it's already broadcasted to dozens of other instances it feels a bit moot. Still, worth doing right if you're going to do it at all - not sure why an instance owner would want to host everything indefinitely anyway. Storage concerns and all. This whole conversation is making me want to take the plunge and check out ActivityPub. "It can't be that hard" lol, right? Queue the narrator: "It was that hard".
    - faangsticle 3y ago
      The thing is that if they want to operate in the EU then this will have to be solved. The right to be forgotten exists, and saying "it's federated lol" is not an excuse.
      - unshavedyak 3y ago
        Sidenote, i wonder if EU requires you keep some information about a user. Ie hypothetically, given some arbitrary P2P setup, you might need to record users that need to be forgotten, any aliases they fall under, etc. Lest you risk publishing said "forgotten" content from another source that is broadcasting. Worse yet if this publication is in a slightly tweaked format that your software doesn't recognize.
  - slashtab 3y ago
    [dead]
- 2Gkashmiri 3y ago
  > Since the operator and developer of lemmy has very problematic politics (defending genocide and homophobia for example), and is demonstrably incredibly hostile to non-authoritarians, giving him permanent access to your data (even if you delete your account) is a very bad idea. this is talking about the developer of an AGPL 3.0 licensed software. WHAT HAS THE DEVELOPERS politics or for that matter, anything got to do with selfhosting lemmy ? isn't this problem with google or facebook yet no one seems to care about that but oh my god, its lemmy. also, what operator is this talking about in particular because lemmy is a FEDERATED SOFTWARE. there are hundreds of active servers
  - jasonm23 3y ago
    Could you provide links to references and sources for Lemmy's operator doing these things, so we are not just consuming heresay. I would really appreciate it.
    - 2Gkashmiri 3y ago
      i...... was making fun of the OP who wrote the above comment.

class4behavior 3y ago

Decentralization is what both public and private social media needs, which tildes does not offer; but Lemmy specifically is not the long-term answer to Reddit either. Still, that's irrelevant because mobility is one of the main purposes of the fediverse. That is, move to Lemmy or something else like kbin, yet, you're connected and may move again later on. Transferring of one's own content is still an open issue, though. Besides, while tildes incorporates a lot of the lessons mods learned already after the first half a dozen years of Reddit, it is not meant to scale. It's a platform for small/medium instances, not very large ones. It's a pity, though, there is so little support for decentralization/federation just because its design is a bigger challenge. Another reason is, however, the absence of a constitutional protection of one's privacy outside one's own property. Because of that the consumers of the dominating nation in that market don't really grasp nor care about that aspect.

kvetching 3y ago
how does content moderation occur with a fully decentralized network? Do they have a democratic type system whereby you can vote to have things removed? I'm thinking about some sort of PI being exposed or illicit media.

luuurker 3y ago

Tildes doesn't feel like a reddit replacement. There are limited "subs", "nsfw" content or discussions aren't allowed, has been invite-only for years, etc. I don't know if Lemmy is a good alternative either.

satvikpendem 3y ago
It's more of an HN replacement (or addition) where you can get pretty detailed posts and comments without jokes and memes. It's like if HN added subs for games, hobbies, etc.
EA-3167 3y ago
I've heard some pretty sketchy stories about Tildes moderation unfortunately, people being permabanned for obscure reasons within days of signing up for example. If that's where they're starting from, I'm not sure I want to see where they're going.

stiltzkin 3y ago

Tildes has stated they are not looking to be a Reddit alternative. They want to be narrow and deep in conversation so no images posts and porn. Also Reddit and HN has privacy issues.