3 ms·

And what exactly is the monopoly here, AI chatbots, or Edge as a browser used to access them?

by veave 3y ago

nolok 3y ago
I think monopoly is not the right term, but I don't know the correct one. They control a huge share of one market, and they use it to force their way into another in an unfair way (Microsoft: windows to push edge and keep making it default and making it harder and harder and scarier to switch, and now using edge to push their own web services; Google: gmail & co to push chrome, ...). One would argue "if it's not a monopoly is it not legal ?" but that's sort of my point, if it's illegal it should be punished, if it's currently legal it should be regulated. We cannot keep treating browsers like a regular piece of software when they're becoming more and more like an utility. I sort of feel the same way toward OSes, but browsers are even more important.
- princevegeta89 3y ago
  "Free will and abuse of power"
- yard2010 3y ago
  I think the term here is centralization or lack of diversity
- veave 3y ago
  They only have 5.31% of browser market share https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share
  - nolok 3y ago
    Which mean there is still time to stop their abuse in Windows, unlike last time with internet explorer when we reacted too late. Changing browsers went from a simple and smooth experience in 7/8, to one with roadblocks and warning in 10, to one that's absurdely abusive in 11, all to push Edge forward.
    - ztrww 3y ago
      what you’re advocating would only increase chrome’s dominance to 95%+. there artificial limitations imposed by Apple and MS are the only things that are keeping the browser market marginally competitive.
      - nolok 3y ago
        Yes and no. I'm this thread's OP and like I said in the main post I believe they should go against google/chrome too to impose some rules.
        ztrww 3y ago
        > some rules like what? and why do you think they could help? They’d have to somehow explicitly target Chrome to give it’s competitors a chance. IE did not go to down because of some EU regulations or the bundling ban because Mozilla and Google simply released better browser.
- ztrww 3y ago
  Only realistic outcome from this would be Google/Chrome becoming even more dominant since there would be no reason for anyone to use any other browser.
- jefftk 3y ago
  In this case Microsoft is using Bing Chat to promote Edge use, but Bing Chat doesn't have anything close to a dominant position so it's hard for me to see an argument that this isn't allowed under US anti-trust (or that it should be prohibited).
mort96 3y ago
There are forms of anti-competitive practices which don't involve abusing an absolute monopoly.

And what exactly is the monopoly here, AI chatbots, or Edge as a browser used to access them?

by veave 3y ago

And what exactly is the monopoly here, AI chatbots, or Edge as a browser used to access them?

I think monopoly is not the right term, but I don't know the correct one. They control a huge share of one market, and they use it to force their way into another in an unfair way (Microsoft: windows to push edge and keep making it default and making it harder and harder and scarier to switch, and now using edge to push their own web services; Google: gmail & co to push chrome, ...). One would argue "if it's not a monopoly is it not legal ?" but that's sort of my point, if it's illegal it should be punished, if it's currently legal it should be regulated. We cannot keep treating browsers like a regular piece of software when they're becoming more and more like an utility. I sort of feel the same way toward OSes, but browsers are even more important.

princevegeta89 3y ago
"Free will and abuse of power"
yard2010 3y ago
I think the term here is centralization or lack of diversity
veave 3y ago
They only have 5.31% of browser market share https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share
- nolok 3y ago
  Which mean there is still time to stop their abuse in Windows, unlike last time with internet explorer when we reacted too late. Changing browsers went from a simple and smooth experience in 7/8, to one with roadblocks and warning in 10, to one that's absurdely abusive in 11, all to push Edge forward.
  - ztrww 3y ago
    what you’re advocating would only increase chrome’s dominance to 95%+. there artificial limitations imposed by Apple and MS are the only things that are keeping the browser market marginally competitive.
    - nolok 3y ago
      Yes and no. I'm this thread's OP and like I said in the main post I believe they should go against google/chrome too to impose some rules.
      - ztrww 3y ago
        > some rules like what? and why do you think they could help? They’d have to somehow explicitly target Chrome to give it’s competitors a chance. IE did not go to down because of some EU regulations or the bundling ban because Mozilla and Google simply released better browser.
ztrww 3y ago
Only realistic outcome from this would be Google/Chrome becoming even more dominant since there would be no reason for anyone to use any other browser.
jefftk 3y ago
In this case Microsoft is using Bing Chat to promote Edge use, but Bing Chat doesn't have anything close to a dominant position so it's hard for me to see an argument that this isn't allowed under US anti-trust (or that it should be prohibited).

mort96 3y ago

There are forms of anti-competitive practices which don't involve abusing an absolute monopoly.