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Congratulations for working for free for a for-profit company? Might I recommend you to turn towards places like Lemmy or other less-commercial and less exploi

by pierat 3y ago

Congratulations for working for free for a for-profit company? Might I recommend you to turn towards places like Lemmy or other less-commercial and less exploitive websites? Reddit relies on free work, but doesn't value or help the mods. And now, they're doubling down on screwing everyone and manufacturing fake content for what appears their IPO. I think it's time to skedaddle.

autoexec 3y ago
I think I'm out of the loop... what is this about manufacturing fake content?
- EamonnMR 3y ago
  Probably referring to this: https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/13p889x/reddit_admins_were_just_caught_using_bots_or_fake/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/13p889x/red...
  - morkalork 3y ago
    Can't fault them for following a tried and true strategy from the same platform: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/reddit-founders-made-hundreds-of-fake-profiles-so-site-looked-popular/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/reddi...
unethical_ban 3y ago
You mean "volunteering to keep a community forum polite and productive". I wish people would quit shitting on mods like they're idiots for taking out the trash. Yes, though, the larger subreddits are political and repost astroturf. Anti-american garbage. But not every sub is like that. I'll look into Lemmy though.
- BaseballPhysics 3y ago
  > You mean "volunteering to keep a community forum polite and productive". Both of those things can be true. The reality is those communities--which only thrive on Reddit because of effective moderation--are built on a private platform whose primary method of generating profits is to monetize the attention of those community members. So, yes, those mods are absolutely contributing free labour that Reddit is turning into private profits, and that labour comes in the form of volunteering to keep those forums polite and productive. Whether or not that's a reasonable tradeoff is up to each individual, though I have to confess I don't personally understand it (despite, in the past, benefiting from it). At least my day job pays me for the labour that they monetize. And now Reddit is taking a dump all over those free labourers by taking away critical tools that they use to make those forums polite and productive in the first place.
  - pierat 3y ago
    Thank you. That's why I recommended putting "volunteering time" with actual non-profit orgs and groups, so that 100% of the labor goes to all. I didn't advocate "quit volunteering for a community", cause that's the wrong thing to advocate. There's mastodon, Lemmy for 2. Discord isn't great, given earlier in the curve of monetization. Same for other for-profit areas. But again, I'd recommend finding communities in a not-profit-driven area and work there. The for-profit side of things has the same death spirals. I'm just sick of this "web2" crap profiteering and killing useful community stuff.
  - EdwardDiego 3y ago
    I mod a technical sub focused on a FOSS project because it's a good place for people to seek advice and share cool tech. I'm doing it for the people, and I'm doing it because I care about the project. It's small though, only just hit 10K subs, and the moderation load is light, basically just ensuring any vendors who turn up actually contribute to the community, not just a drive-by sales blurb.
    - BaseballPhysics 3y ago
      No one said you're doing it for Reddit. Most mods are doing it to support their community. The point is Reddit is pocketing profits from you donating your free labour to the benefit of their private platform. Dress it up however you like, that core fact remains true.
- surgical_fire 3y ago
  I was a moderator for a fairly large subreddit (6 figures subscribers). I was a moron doing free work for a for-profit company. I deserved to be shat on.
  - unethical_ban 3y ago
    That's fair, but that isn't how I felt. I was the mod for a city subreddit for a while and while it was tiring, it was easy to do (especially with a medium sized group, each pitching in a little bit). Keep the spam and trolling down, and community engagement up. (Then I got banned for calling a spammer on a large message board a spammer). Name an online community space that isn't a for-profit company, that more than a few hundred people could name. Facebook Instagram Nextdoor Meetup Reddit Whoops.
    - surgical_fire 3y ago
      > Name an online community space that isn't a for-profit company, that more than a few hundred people could name. I have nothing against for profit companies. I am vehemently against of donating labor to for-profit companies. Especially when they will betray those that provided free labor when it becomes convenient. Reddit proved me right.
    - skinnymuch 3y ago
      Those are all pretty general platforms. A city community is a specific niche that could work anywhere including on its own. Community building doesn’t have to be only picking one general social media mega platform to live off of.
tester457 3y ago
Lemmy is too slow to take off. And federation is too inconvenient for the average user.
- digitallyfree 3y ago
  It's not easy to move a group to a new platform, and there's very little people using Lemmy currently. The thing about Reddit despite its flaws is that it allows access to many large communities with a single account.
bmacho 3y ago
> Congratulations for working for free for a for-profit company? They work for themselves, and use reddit resources free. If anything, this relationship is beneficial for the community, but reddit.
- Panzer04 3y ago
  Reddit massively benefits from the existence of the community. They are sacrificing goodwill in the hope that the higher revenue per user is worth the backlash.

by pierat 3y ago

autoexec 3y ago

I think I'm out of the loop... what is this about manufacturing fake content?

EamonnMR 3y ago
Probably referring to this: https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/13p889x/reddit_admins_were_just_caught_using_bots_or_fake/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/13p889x/red...
- morkalork 3y ago
  Can't fault them for following a tried and true strategy from the same platform: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/reddit-founders-made-hundreds-of-fake-profiles-so-site-looked-popular/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/reddi...

unethical_ban 3y ago

You mean "volunteering to keep a community forum polite and productive". I wish people would quit shitting on mods like they're idiots for taking out the trash. Yes, though, the larger subreddits are political and repost astroturf. Anti-american garbage. But not every sub is like that. I'll look into Lemmy though.

BaseballPhysics 3y ago
> You mean "volunteering to keep a community forum polite and productive". Both of those things can be true. The reality is those communities--which only thrive on Reddit because of effective moderation--are built on a private platform whose primary method of generating profits is to monetize the attention of those community members. So, yes, those mods are absolutely contributing free labour that Reddit is turning into private profits, and that labour comes in the form of volunteering to keep those forums polite and productive. Whether or not that's a reasonable tradeoff is up to each individual, though I have to confess I don't personally understand it (despite, in the past, benefiting from it). At least my day job pays me for the labour that they monetize. And now Reddit is taking a dump all over those free labourers by taking away critical tools that they use to make those forums polite and productive in the first place.
- pierat 3y ago
  Thank you. That's why I recommended putting "volunteering time" with actual non-profit orgs and groups, so that 100% of the labor goes to all. I didn't advocate "quit volunteering for a community", cause that's the wrong thing to advocate. There's mastodon, Lemmy for 2. Discord isn't great, given earlier in the curve of monetization. Same for other for-profit areas. But again, I'd recommend finding communities in a not-profit-driven area and work there. The for-profit side of things has the same death spirals. I'm just sick of this "web2" crap profiteering and killing useful community stuff.
- EdwardDiego 3y ago
  I mod a technical sub focused on a FOSS project because it's a good place for people to seek advice and share cool tech. I'm doing it for the people, and I'm doing it because I care about the project. It's small though, only just hit 10K subs, and the moderation load is light, basically just ensuring any vendors who turn up actually contribute to the community, not just a drive-by sales blurb.
  - BaseballPhysics 3y ago
    No one said you're doing it for Reddit. Most mods are doing it to support their community. The point is Reddit is pocketing profits from you donating your free labour to the benefit of their private platform. Dress it up however you like, that core fact remains true.
surgical_fire 3y ago
I was a moderator for a fairly large subreddit (6 figures subscribers). I was a moron doing free work for a for-profit company. I deserved to be shat on.
- unethical_ban 3y ago
  That's fair, but that isn't how I felt. I was the mod for a city subreddit for a while and while it was tiring, it was easy to do (especially with a medium sized group, each pitching in a little bit). Keep the spam and trolling down, and community engagement up. (Then I got banned for calling a spammer on a large message board a spammer). Name an online community space that isn't a for-profit company, that more than a few hundred people could name. Facebook Instagram Nextdoor Meetup Reddit Whoops.
  - surgical_fire 3y ago
    > Name an online community space that isn't a for-profit company, that more than a few hundred people could name. I have nothing against for profit companies. I am vehemently against of donating labor to for-profit companies. Especially when they will betray those that provided free labor when it becomes convenient. Reddit proved me right.
  - skinnymuch 3y ago
    Those are all pretty general platforms. A city community is a specific niche that could work anywhere including on its own. Community building doesn’t have to be only picking one general social media mega platform to live off of.

tester457 3y ago

Lemmy is too slow to take off. And federation is too inconvenient for the average user.

digitallyfree 3y ago
It's not easy to move a group to a new platform, and there's very little people using Lemmy currently. The thing about Reddit despite its flaws is that it allows access to many large communities with a single account.

bmacho 3y ago

> Congratulations for working for free for a for-profit company? They work for themselves, and use reddit resources free. If anything, this relationship is beneficial for the community, but reddit.

Panzer04 3y ago
Reddit massively benefits from the existence of the community. They are sacrificing goodwill in the hope that the higher revenue per user is worth the backlash.