5 ms·

Why is the answer ~29 liters? Since it takes just over two minutes to complete a lap, you can complete no more than 9 laps in 20 minutes. At 2.73 liters/lap, th

Why is the answer ~29 liters? Since it takes just over two minutes to complete a lap, you can complete no more than 9 laps in 20 minutes. At 2.73 liters/lap, that's 9 x 2.73 = 24.57 liters, no? Or maybe I don't understand the rules.

KeplerBoy 3y ago
Probably just some margin of safety. At least that's how it's done in non-sim racing.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
nmarinov 3y ago
From the referenced thread[0]: > GPT-3.5 gave me a right-ish answer of 24.848 liters, but it did not realize the last lap needs to be completed once the leader finishes. GPT-4 gave me 28-29 liters as the answer, recognizing that a partial lap needs to be added due to race rules, and that it's good to have 1-2 liters of safety buffer. [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35893130 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35893130
- geysersam 3y ago
  I don't believe that for a second. If that's the answer it gave it's cherry picked and lucky. There are many examples where GPT4 fails spectacularly at much simpler reasoning tasks. I still think ChatGPT is amazing, but we shouldn't pretend it's something it isn't. I wouldn't trust GPT4 to tell me how much fuel I should put in my car. Would you?
  - mustacheemperor 3y ago
    >I don't believe that for a second. This seems needlessly flippant and dismissive, especially when you could just crack open ChatGPT to verify, assuming you have plus or api access. I just did, and ChatGPT gave me a well-reasoned explanation that factored in the extra details about racing the other commenters noted. >There are many examples where GPT4 fails spectacularly at much simpler reasoning tasks. I pose it would be more productive conversation if you would share some of those examples, so we can all compare them to the rather impressive example the top comment shared. >I wouldn't trust GPT4 to tell me how much fuel I should put in my car. Would you? Not if I was trying to win a race, but I can see how this particular example is a useful way to gauge how an LLM handles a task that looks at first like a simple math problem but requires some deeper insight to answer correctly.
    - majormajor 3y ago
      > Not if I was trying to win a race, but I can see how this particular example is a useful way to gauge how an LLM handles a task that looks at first like a simple math problem but requires some deeper insight to answer correctly. It's not just testing reasoning, though, it's also testing fairly niche knowledge. I think a better test of pure reasoning would include all the rules and tips like "it's good to have some buffer" in the prompt.
  - Kiro 3y ago
    At least debunk the example before you start talking about the shortcomings. Right now your comment feels really misplaced when it's a reply to an example where it actually shows a great deal of complex reasoning.
underyx 3y ago
> you can complete no more than 9 laps in 20 minutes Note that according to standard racing rules, this means you end up driving 10 laps in total, because the last incomplete lap is driven to completion by every driver. The rest of the extra fuel comes from adding a safety buffer, as various things can make you use a bit more fuel than expected: the bit of extra driving leading up to the start of the race, racing incidents and consequent damage to the car, difference in driving style, fighting other cars a lot, needing to carry the extra weight of enough fuel for a whole race compared to the practice fuel load where 2.73 l/lap was measured. What I really appreciate in GPT-4 is that even though the question looks like a simple math problem, it actually took these real world considerations into account when answering.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- bragr 3y ago
  Yeah in my attempt at this prompt, it even explained: >Since you cannot complete a fraction of a lap, you'll need to round up to the nearest whole lap. Therefore, you'll be completing 10 laps in the race.
dsjoerg 3y ago
> Since it takes just over two minutes to complete a lap Where did you get that from?
- Nition 3y ago
  The qualifying time was 2:04.317

KeplerBoy 3y ago

Probably just some margin of safety. At least that's how it's done in non-sim racing.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

nmarinov 3y ago

From the referenced thread[0]: > GPT-3.5 gave me a right-ish answer of 24.848 liters, but it did not realize the last lap needs to be completed once the leader finishes. GPT-4 gave me 28-29 liters as the answer, recognizing that a partial lap needs to be added due to race rules, and that it's good to have 1-2 liters of safety buffer. [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35893130 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35893130

geysersam 3y ago
I don't believe that for a second. If that's the answer it gave it's cherry picked and lucky. There are many examples where GPT4 fails spectacularly at much simpler reasoning tasks. I still think ChatGPT is amazing, but we shouldn't pretend it's something it isn't. I wouldn't trust GPT4 to tell me how much fuel I should put in my car. Would you?
- mustacheemperor 3y ago
  >I don't believe that for a second. This seems needlessly flippant and dismissive, especially when you could just crack open ChatGPT to verify, assuming you have plus or api access. I just did, and ChatGPT gave me a well-reasoned explanation that factored in the extra details about racing the other commenters noted. >There are many examples where GPT4 fails spectacularly at much simpler reasoning tasks. I pose it would be more productive conversation if you would share some of those examples, so we can all compare them to the rather impressive example the top comment shared. >I wouldn't trust GPT4 to tell me how much fuel I should put in my car. Would you? Not if I was trying to win a race, but I can see how this particular example is a useful way to gauge how an LLM handles a task that looks at first like a simple math problem but requires some deeper insight to answer correctly.
  - majormajor 3y ago
    > Not if I was trying to win a race, but I can see how this particular example is a useful way to gauge how an LLM handles a task that looks at first like a simple math problem but requires some deeper insight to answer correctly. It's not just testing reasoning, though, it's also testing fairly niche knowledge. I think a better test of pure reasoning would include all the rules and tips like "it's good to have some buffer" in the prompt.
- Kiro 3y ago
  At least debunk the example before you start talking about the shortcomings. Right now your comment feels really misplaced when it's a reply to an example where it actually shows a great deal of complex reasoning.

underyx 3y ago

> you can complete no more than 9 laps in 20 minutes Note that according to standard racing rules, this means you end up driving 10 laps in total, because the last incomplete lap is driven to completion by every driver. The rest of the extra fuel comes from adding a safety buffer, as various things can make you use a bit more fuel than expected: the bit of extra driving leading up to the start of the race, racing incidents and consequent damage to the car, difference in driving style, fighting other cars a lot, needing to carry the extra weight of enough fuel for a whole race compared to the practice fuel load where 2.73 l/lap was measured. What I really appreciate in GPT-4 is that even though the question looks like a simple math problem, it actually took these real world considerations into account when answering.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
bragr 3y ago
Yeah in my attempt at this prompt, it even explained: >Since you cannot complete a fraction of a lap, you'll need to round up to the nearest whole lap. Therefore, you'll be completing 10 laps in the race.

dsjoerg 3y ago

> Since it takes just over two minutes to complete a lap Where did you get that from?

Nition 3y ago
The qualifying time was 2:04.317