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A thousand years is a lot of time for an industry that has practically forgotten its death-and-resurrection experience of just fifteen years ago. One thing is

A thousand years is a lot of time for an industry that has practically forgotten its death-and-resurrection experience of just fifteen years ago. One thing is for sure: Technology will ensure that the fine art of relieving "suckers" from their monetary assets will reach ever higher levels of sophistication.

llampx 3y ago
And where Technology can't reach, regulation and lobbyists are there for!
phone8675309 3y ago
Calling the 2008 financial crisis a "death-and-resurrection experience" is a bit hyperbolic. Nobody important went to jail, the banks got bailed out after a couple of them merged, and the bankers still got their bonuses. The only people that got fucked were the customers. The financiers got their just fine.
- landoftheice 3y ago
  [dead]
- nologic01 3y ago
  > is a bit hyperbolic Well, I had to articulate something that will ring true (or at least be quoted) for at least a thousand years. You can't do that with measured expressions. But on the main point, outward manifestation of deep crisis makes indeed for pop-corn consumption but I don't think I really exaggerate if I say that the crisis was a death moment for an entire industry. The resurrection worked. But it brought back a zombie. The foundational myth of the financial sector, its calling card to society has been shredded. While in a world of TINA's the gainful milking of broken financial / banking systems continues unabated, this is not enough for a sector "to own the future" and NPV an infinite stream of cash. It is now lost in fading memories but there was a time when the masters of the information universe were not "big tech" but "big finance". Just like now there is a pseudo-ideology around "organizing the world's information" or "connecting all people", bankers used to have a pseudo-ideology about optimizing all the economy by transactionizing, financializing, securitising and marketising everything. In fact, as the crypto boom conveniently reminded us, that ersatz ideology is still lurking around, available to any tribe that wants to try its hand at "reinventing finance" using tech.
- pjc50 3y ago
  The customers were, with a few exceptions (Kaupthing overseas customers, rich Cypriots) fine. The shareholders absorbed losses. The US government TARP ultimately basically broke even. Other governments did less well. Ireland got screwed over, but managed to send Sean Quinn to actual jail. The UK lost £32bn on RBS https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/uk-government-s-losses-from-delayed-rbs-exit-estimated-at-163-32-1b-57539729 https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights... ; Fred Goodwin was not jailed, although he did eventually have his knighthood taken away. The Greek government was almost collapsed, despite not directly having a huge link to the banking sector at all.
  - phone8675309 3y ago
    Tell all of my friends whose retirement funds dropped significantly as a result of this that they were fine. In any civilized country, the government would have conditioned bailouts on the people at the top being fired and prosecuted. The business criminals specifically counted on a bailout, and they should have to pay for that with treasure, flesh, and time in prison, but instead of doing any of that, disincentivizing that behavior going forward, they instead encouraged it. That crypto companies did not get that treatment is a function of them not being the cornerstone of the economy, just a bunch of middle-class and rich people getting fucked on the side.
    - quickthrowman 3y ago
      > Tell all of my friends whose retirement funds dropped significantly as a result of this that they were fine. Were they retired at the time? I’m going to assume they were working. If stocks drop 40% and you still have a job and can contribute to your retirement and personal investment accounts, a 40% drop in stocks is a sale on stocks, not a bad thing. How are their retirement funds doing now that the S&P 500 is at ~4300 in 2023 instead of ~6xx in 2008? That’s a 7x increase from the bottom in 15 years. Assuming they didn’t do something stupid like panic sell at the bottom and buy back in years later, they’re doing just fine now.
      - 3y ago

llampx 3y ago

And where Technology can't reach, regulation and lobbyists are there for!

phone8675309 3y ago

Calling the 2008 financial crisis a "death-and-resurrection experience" is a bit hyperbolic. Nobody important went to jail, the banks got bailed out after a couple of them merged, and the bankers still got their bonuses. The only people that got fucked were the customers. The financiers got their just fine.

landoftheice 3y ago
[dead]
nologic01 3y ago
> is a bit hyperbolic Well, I had to articulate something that will ring true (or at least be quoted) for at least a thousand years. You can't do that with measured expressions. But on the main point, outward manifestation of deep crisis makes indeed for pop-corn consumption but I don't think I really exaggerate if I say that the crisis was a death moment for an entire industry. The resurrection worked. But it brought back a zombie. The foundational myth of the financial sector, its calling card to society has been shredded. While in a world of TINA's the gainful milking of broken financial / banking systems continues unabated, this is not enough for a sector "to own the future" and NPV an infinite stream of cash. It is now lost in fading memories but there was a time when the masters of the information universe were not "big tech" but "big finance". Just like now there is a pseudo-ideology around "organizing the world's information" or "connecting all people", bankers used to have a pseudo-ideology about optimizing all the economy by transactionizing, financializing, securitising and marketising everything. In fact, as the crypto boom conveniently reminded us, that ersatz ideology is still lurking around, available to any tribe that wants to try its hand at "reinventing finance" using tech.
pjc50 3y ago
The customers were, with a few exceptions (Kaupthing overseas customers, rich Cypriots) fine. The shareholders absorbed losses. The US government TARP ultimately basically broke even. Other governments did less well. Ireland got screwed over, but managed to send Sean Quinn to actual jail. The UK lost £32bn on RBS https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/uk-government-s-losses-from-delayed-rbs-exit-estimated-at-163-32-1b-57539729 https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights... ; Fred Goodwin was not jailed, although he did eventually have his knighthood taken away. The Greek government was almost collapsed, despite not directly having a huge link to the banking sector at all.
- phone8675309 3y ago
  Tell all of my friends whose retirement funds dropped significantly as a result of this that they were fine. In any civilized country, the government would have conditioned bailouts on the people at the top being fired and prosecuted. The business criminals specifically counted on a bailout, and they should have to pay for that with treasure, flesh, and time in prison, but instead of doing any of that, disincentivizing that behavior going forward, they instead encouraged it. That crypto companies did not get that treatment is a function of them not being the cornerstone of the economy, just a bunch of middle-class and rich people getting fucked on the side.
  - quickthrowman 3y ago
    > Tell all of my friends whose retirement funds dropped significantly as a result of this that they were fine. Were they retired at the time? I’m going to assume they were working. If stocks drop 40% and you still have a job and can contribute to your retirement and personal investment accounts, a 40% drop in stocks is a sale on stocks, not a bad thing. How are their retirement funds doing now that the S&P 500 is at ~4300 in 2023 instead of ~6xx in 2008? That’s a 7x increase from the bottom in 15 years. Assuming they didn’t do something stupid like panic sell at the bottom and buy back in years later, they’re doing just fine now.
    - 3y ago