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I'm trying to figure out what the basis for this decision is, interested in your thoughts on this... It's not about paying fair wages because as others have no

I'm trying to figure out what the basis for this decision is, interested in your thoughts on this... It's not about paying fair wages because as others have noted, takeout is being handled by the same people on the same wages. It can't be about taking the order, because again, takeout. Is it about bringing the food to the table? Because boxing up takeout orders or bringing them out of the kitchen feels pretty much the same to me. Is it about serving drinks? Well those are also in takeout/fast food/etc. Is it about asking how your meal is going? That doesn't have a direct equivalent, but is it worth tens of dollars to be asked how your meal is and reply "it's great thanks". I'm only familiar with US tipping culture from the internet, the UK doesn't have the same, or I'm oblivious to it and don't tip. I've always found the tipping reasons a bit arbitrary though. I understand using table service as a condition in order to reduce the situations in which you're tipping, but it feels like the tipping needs to be connected to an explicit service, and yet from the above I feel like it isn't, so it's still arbitrary.

bobthepanda 3y ago
Carrying a lot of plates that are open is a bit of a skill as opposed to boxes; most people would struggle without a tray. There’s also bussing the table and cleaning up afterwards.
- danpalmer 3y ago
  Good point about the cleaning, but there's a lot of cleaning that happens without table service, including for example, clearing up mess at fast food restaurants where I'm sure tips aren't generally being paid. Carrying plates is more work than carrying a takeout bag, but is carrying plates a few meters the thing that warrants tens of dollars? Hell to save $10 on a meal I'd happily collect it from the kitchen myself. Some places even do this with the little buzzers that go off.
  - bobthepanda 3y ago
    I don’t normally eat at places where a single person is spending $50 per meal (assuming 20% tip). And if you have multiple people, depending on the type of food and the portion size that number of plates and glasses expands. It’s worth noting that the tip is distributed amongst people who serve, so at a $50 price point that probably includes whoever made/recommended your drink. I also wouldn’t tip at buzzer places.
ehutch79 3y ago
Wait staff when there's table service are usually exempt from minimum wage. So they're paid a pitence, and tipping is how they get a reasonable wage. Counter help at starbucks or whatnot are paid normal wages, and don't need tips to make more than $2.50/hr
- danpalmer 3y ago
  Another commenter suggested that wait staff are taking takeout orders and packaging them up. I'm assuming they're not paid minimum wage for that portion of their work, so then it seems like this isn't the right basis for tipping or not tipping.
- lores 3y ago
  They aren't - all 50 states have laws to the effect that minimum wage is minimum wage. The states that also have a lower "tipped minimum wage" require the business to make up the difference if tmw + tips < mw. Which makes tipping even more infuriating, since why single out service staff when Amazon warehouse workers have worse jobs at the same basic pay? Raise the minimum wage to something livable, make prices transparent, and be done with tipping. Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wage https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wage
goosedragons 3y ago
In the US servers are typically paid a much lower minimum wage like $2 an hour than a fast food worker vs. $7+ (depends on State/location). Tips are basically required to have a living wage. While they may be the one to hand you the takeout bag it feels a little silly to pay them 15%+ to have them hand a bag over and there was no expectation for it pre-COVID. Serving is a more time intensive task. Yes, it is kind of silly in general. What's worse is where I live in Canada servers get paid the same but there's still this weird expectation to tip them.
- smileysteve 3y ago
  But no worker handling takeout should be on a tipped minimum wage (realistically, they are shared to this additional activity)
JohnFen 3y ago
> I've always found the tipping reasons a bit arbitrary though. That's because they are completely arbitrary.

bobthepanda 3y ago

Carrying a lot of plates that are open is a bit of a skill as opposed to boxes; most people would struggle without a tray. There’s also bussing the table and cleaning up afterwards.

danpalmer 3y ago
Good point about the cleaning, but there's a lot of cleaning that happens without table service, including for example, clearing up mess at fast food restaurants where I'm sure tips aren't generally being paid. Carrying plates is more work than carrying a takeout bag, but is carrying plates a few meters the thing that warrants tens of dollars? Hell to save $10 on a meal I'd happily collect it from the kitchen myself. Some places even do this with the little buzzers that go off.
- bobthepanda 3y ago
  I don’t normally eat at places where a single person is spending $50 per meal (assuming 20% tip). And if you have multiple people, depending on the type of food and the portion size that number of plates and glasses expands. It’s worth noting that the tip is distributed amongst people who serve, so at a $50 price point that probably includes whoever made/recommended your drink. I also wouldn’t tip at buzzer places.

ehutch79 3y ago

Wait staff when there's table service are usually exempt from minimum wage. So they're paid a pitence, and tipping is how they get a reasonable wage. Counter help at starbucks or whatnot are paid normal wages, and don't need tips to make more than $2.50/hr

danpalmer 3y ago
Another commenter suggested that wait staff are taking takeout orders and packaging them up. I'm assuming they're not paid minimum wage for that portion of their work, so then it seems like this isn't the right basis for tipping or not tipping.
lores 3y ago
They aren't - all 50 states have laws to the effect that minimum wage is minimum wage. The states that also have a lower "tipped minimum wage" require the business to make up the difference if tmw + tips < mw. Which makes tipping even more infuriating, since why single out service staff when Amazon warehouse workers have worse jobs at the same basic pay? Raise the minimum wage to something livable, make prices transparent, and be done with tipping. Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wage https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipped_wage

goosedragons 3y ago

In the US servers are typically paid a much lower minimum wage like $2 an hour than a fast food worker vs. $7+ (depends on State/location). Tips are basically required to have a living wage. While they may be the one to hand you the takeout bag it feels a little silly to pay them 15%+ to have them hand a bag over and there was no expectation for it pre-COVID. Serving is a more time intensive task. Yes, it is kind of silly in general. What's worse is where I live in Canada servers get paid the same but there's still this weird expectation to tip them.

smileysteve 3y ago
But no worker handling takeout should be on a tipped minimum wage (realistically, they are shared to this additional activity)

JohnFen 3y ago

> I've always found the tipping reasons a bit arbitrary though. That's because they are completely arbitrary.