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So Apple wasn't able to increase performance (or even ram capacity) beyond the Ultra series chips. Thats disappointing. Particularly given they took an entire

by stirlo 3y ago

So Apple wasn't able to increase performance (or even ram capacity) beyond the Ultra series chips. Thats disappointing. Particularly given they took an entire extra year to deliver it after the original Ultra release in March 2022.

brucethemoose2 3y ago
Its already known that the M2 line is more of a refresh than a big step over the M1.
- stirlo 3y ago
  Sure, but you'd think that an extra years delay would deliver more than just a Mac Studio chip in a new form factor.
  - gjsman-1000 3y ago
    Not really. Apple doesn't change form factors much - the Mac Mini has tons of empty space but Apple hasn't redesigned it at all from the Intel era. Also, this is Pro equipment. Form factor changes cause frustration, not joy.
    - FireBeyond 3y ago
      Also frustrating is that until this morning Apple would happily charge you full new retail (and margins) on a 2019 CPU. I love my cheesegrater, and it's great for the workloads. But I can't see any real reason to go to this Mac Pro versus the Studio.
gjsman-1000 3y ago
> So Apple wasn't able to increase performance (or even ram capacity) beyond the Ultra series chips. Thats disappointing. Did we watch the same presentation? The M1 Ultra maxed out at 128GB of RAM, the M2 Ultra can handle 192GB. The CPU cores go from 20 to 24. GPU cores go from 64 to 76.
- stirlo 3y ago
  These are minor improvements over the M1 series in line with the other released M2 chips. For a 1 year delay to the original transition timeline and skipping the first generation it's reasonable to expect something more than the high end Ultra chip in a new form factor. How about a 4x, 8x and 16x M2 Max chiplet design which would have truly been next level...
  - gjsman-1000 3y ago
    > How about a 4x, 8x and 16x M2 Max chiplet design which would have truly been next level... That was entirely Bloomberg BSing. The people working on reverse-engineering Apple Silicon said that idea was infeasible all the way back in 2021.
    - stirlo 3y ago
      Its true that Hector Martin said they didn't have the ability to add another interconnect like they did to double the Max to get Ultra. But that ignores the entirely different chip design T6500 which was assumed to be for the new Mac Pro. No technical details of it ever leaked but its reasonable to assume it would offer higher performance than the T6002 chips which became M1 Max/Ultra
      - gjsman-1000 3y ago
        > But that ignores the entirely different chip design T6500 which was assumed to be for the new Mac Pro. The thing about leaks is that they aren't confirmed and might, literally, not exist. In which case, you might be upset at Apple for not releasing a chip that they literally never made. Anyone can make up a fake chip number, create a Chinese account, and make a fake leak for clicks or the lulz, or reach out to a legitimate leaker and mislead them. But let's say it did exist. You are assuming that it can be mass-produced, even in small quantities, without immense waste or excessive resources, or at a R&D cost or tooling cost so large that it will never break even. Some things are just experiments.
  - throw74775 3y ago

by stirlo 3y ago

brucethemoose2 3y ago

Its already known that the M2 line is more of a refresh than a big step over the M1.

stirlo 3y ago
Sure, but you'd think that an extra years delay would deliver more than just a Mac Studio chip in a new form factor.
- gjsman-1000 3y ago
  Not really. Apple doesn't change form factors much - the Mac Mini has tons of empty space but Apple hasn't redesigned it at all from the Intel era. Also, this is Pro equipment. Form factor changes cause frustration, not joy.
  - FireBeyond 3y ago
    Also frustrating is that until this morning Apple would happily charge you full new retail (and margins) on a 2019 CPU. I love my cheesegrater, and it's great for the workloads. But I can't see any real reason to go to this Mac Pro versus the Studio.

gjsman-1000 3y ago

> So Apple wasn't able to increase performance (or even ram capacity) beyond the Ultra series chips. Thats disappointing. Did we watch the same presentation? The M1 Ultra maxed out at 128GB of RAM, the M2 Ultra can handle 192GB. The CPU cores go from 20 to 24. GPU cores go from 64 to 76.

stirlo 3y ago
These are minor improvements over the M1 series in line with the other released M2 chips. For a 1 year delay to the original transition timeline and skipping the first generation it's reasonable to expect something more than the high end Ultra chip in a new form factor. How about a 4x, 8x and 16x M2 Max chiplet design which would have truly been next level...
- gjsman-1000 3y ago
  > How about a 4x, 8x and 16x M2 Max chiplet design which would have truly been next level... That was entirely Bloomberg BSing. The people working on reverse-engineering Apple Silicon said that idea was infeasible all the way back in 2021.
  - stirlo 3y ago
    Its true that Hector Martin said they didn't have the ability to add another interconnect like they did to double the Max to get Ultra. But that ignores the entirely different chip design T6500 which was assumed to be for the new Mac Pro. No technical details of it ever leaked but its reasonable to assume it would offer higher performance than the T6002 chips which became M1 Max/Ultra
    - gjsman-1000 3y ago
      > But that ignores the entirely different chip design T6500 which was assumed to be for the new Mac Pro. The thing about leaks is that they aren't confirmed and might, literally, not exist. In which case, you might be upset at Apple for not releasing a chip that they literally never made. Anyone can make up a fake chip number, create a Chinese account, and make a fake leak for clicks or the lulz, or reach out to a legitimate leaker and mislead them. But let's say it did exist. You are assuming that it can be mass-produced, even in small quantities, without immense waste or excessive resources, or at a R&D cost or tooling cost so large that it will never break even. Some things are just experiments.
- throw74775 3y ago