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> "but that's not in line with profit/corruption... so it won't ever happen." That right there is what saddens me more than almost anything else about modern "

> "but that's not in line with profit/corruption... so it won't ever happen." That right there is what saddens me more than almost anything else about modern "civilized society". Too much of humanity has come to not only accept that "profit/corruption at any cost is perfectly normal" mindset, but some actually even try to defend it. It's often the root cause of so many of humanity's worst nightmare scenarios (many of which are coming true "in realtime" these days), yet many of us will fight to the death against any change of the "status quo", despite the fact that it's highly likely to literally kill us all (as well as other life that lives here alongside us). Just because "it's always been done that way" (It hasn't, BTW. Constant change is more typically the normal state of reality, and it's pretty much always been that way.) doesn't mean it's ever been the right way or the best way.

latchkey 3y ago
The thing I learned living there is that there is corruption everywhere. It is in the US just as much as it is in Vietnam. It just takes different forms.
- refurb 3y ago
  The US is nowhere close to the level of corruption in Vietnam. It’s pervasive in every police interaction, every interaction with government officials, to the point you cant get by day to day without paying bribes. Even in everyday things like getting a passport or registering your residence, let alone major interactions like buying a home or starting a business. And it’s widely accepted by both the people taking bribes and giving them that it’s just “how it is”. It’s upfront, in your face and very few think it’s a big deal. The US (or other Western countries) are nowhere close to that.
  - latchkey 3y ago
    To be 100% honest, I kind of appreciated it when I was there. It definitely reeked of 'white privilege' though. Need something done more quickly (or well)? Just hand someone some cash. I'd much rather just pay for a traffic ticket on the spot rather than deal with local city bureaucracy. In the end, it kind of keeps the wheels turning there. It really is just a different type of corruption. In the US, the bribes just come in the form of political donations, or giving someone's family member some work. I owned a bar/nightclub and we were expected to donate to the fireman's fund. I donated to Mark Leno too, despite not liking the guy at all. I mean, look at the people who got the contracts to build trump's border walls!
    - refurb 3y ago
      You’re not the only one. Lots of wealthy Vietnamese like it too since it can get you a business edge and money buys you a lot. But it’s poisonous. The country will never develop beyond something like Malaysia with that level of corruption. One reason why Singapore is so wealthy is the crackdown on corruption. It’s just not tolerated. And if disagree it’s anything like the US. When immigration officials ask for “tips” to do their job it’s beyond anything you’d see in the West. https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/i-felt-i-was-held-hostage-singaporean-claims-he-was-asked-tip-hanoi-airport-immigration https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/i-felt-i-was-held-hostage-...
      - latchkey 3y ago
        The reason why there is corruption at the govt job level in Vietnam is because a lot of the jobs can only be gotten by family members or buying them. The street police (golden tigers) have to pay to get their job and the only way they can keep it is by taking bribes. US did a pretty good job of preventing that sort of thing with more fair access to jobs. That said, Jared Kushner didn't get the Saudis to give him billions of dollars because he's some magical savant. The corruption is right in front of our faces, yet people just tolerate it differently here.
        refurb 3y ago
        Jared Kushner wasn’t in the government when he raised money for an investment fund. How is that corruption?
        latchkey 3y ago
        https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/06/us/politics/chris-christie-2024-presidential-candidate.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/06/us/politics/chris-christi... “The grift from this family is breathtaking,” Mr. Christie said. “It’s breathtaking. Jared Kushner and Ivanka Kushner walk out of the White House and months later get $2 billion from the Saudis?” “That’s your money he stole,” he continued, adding, “That makes us a banana republic.”

latchkey 3y ago

The thing I learned living there is that there is corruption everywhere. It is in the US just as much as it is in Vietnam. It just takes different forms.

refurb 3y ago
The US is nowhere close to the level of corruption in Vietnam. It’s pervasive in every police interaction, every interaction with government officials, to the point you cant get by day to day without paying bribes. Even in everyday things like getting a passport or registering your residence, let alone major interactions like buying a home or starting a business. And it’s widely accepted by both the people taking bribes and giving them that it’s just “how it is”. It’s upfront, in your face and very few think it’s a big deal. The US (or other Western countries) are nowhere close to that.
- latchkey 3y ago
  To be 100% honest, I kind of appreciated it when I was there. It definitely reeked of 'white privilege' though. Need something done more quickly (or well)? Just hand someone some cash. I'd much rather just pay for a traffic ticket on the spot rather than deal with local city bureaucracy. In the end, it kind of keeps the wheels turning there. It really is just a different type of corruption. In the US, the bribes just come in the form of political donations, or giving someone's family member some work. I owned a bar/nightclub and we were expected to donate to the fireman's fund. I donated to Mark Leno too, despite not liking the guy at all. I mean, look at the people who got the contracts to build trump's border walls!
  - refurb 3y ago
    You’re not the only one. Lots of wealthy Vietnamese like it too since it can get you a business edge and money buys you a lot. But it’s poisonous. The country will never develop beyond something like Malaysia with that level of corruption. One reason why Singapore is so wealthy is the crackdown on corruption. It’s just not tolerated. And if disagree it’s anything like the US. When immigration officials ask for “tips” to do their job it’s beyond anything you’d see in the West. https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/i-felt-i-was-held-hostage-singaporean-claims-he-was-asked-tip-hanoi-airport-immigration https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/i-felt-i-was-held-hostage-...
    - latchkey 3y ago
      The reason why there is corruption at the govt job level in Vietnam is because a lot of the jobs can only be gotten by family members or buying them. The street police (golden tigers) have to pay to get their job and the only way they can keep it is by taking bribes. US did a pretty good job of preventing that sort of thing with more fair access to jobs. That said, Jared Kushner didn't get the Saudis to give him billions of dollars because he's some magical savant. The corruption is right in front of our faces, yet people just tolerate it differently here.
      - refurb 3y ago
        Jared Kushner wasn’t in the government when he raised money for an investment fund. How is that corruption?
        latchkey 3y ago
        https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/06/us/politics/chris-christie-2024-presidential-candidate.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/06/us/politics/chris-christi... “The grift from this family is breathtaking,” Mr. Christie said. “It’s breathtaking. Jared Kushner and Ivanka Kushner walk out of the White House and months later get $2 billion from the Saudis?” “That’s your money he stole,” he continued, adding, “That makes us a banana republic.”