5 ms·

Thats not incorrect. The idea that people working for companies making basic supplies are guilty of murder for what their own government did with said supplies

Thats not incorrect. The idea that people working for companies making basic supplies are guilty of murder for what their own government did with said supplies without their knowledge is so absurd that by your own admission they were not even tried. But that makes the trials of people who were fair? How about you directly enumerate the rights they were or were not afforded to determine if their trials were fair.

oezi 3y ago
> without their knowledge I would beg to differ. The industrial magnates of this German era where all well aware of what their supplies were going towards: A 'total war' that didn't stop at exterminating anybody considered inferior. Each individual case is certainly difficult but there is a line where you can and should be tried as an employee for participating in something which violates laws and or ethical boundaries. And this doesn't apply only to the manufacturing of something like Zyklon B nerve gas.
- KRAKRISMOTT 3y ago
  Do you expect the executives of Raytheon and Lockheed to be put on trial if they lose a war too? You don't want to open that can of worms. Living by the sword is for soldiers and military, not for the civilian government. In the past, royalty who lost a battle were treated well and ransomed precisely to prevent blowback when the shoe is on the other foot.
  - vkou 3y ago
    If the US starts a six-year war of extermination against Jews and Slavs and Roma and others, killing 30 million people, I think more than the executives of Raytheon should stand to lose their heads, but it would be a good start. It certainly wouldn't help their case if they also used slave labour, and bankrolled the fringe party that went ahead to seize power, and unleash that horror upon the world. 'Just following orders' isn't a valid defense for a lieutenant, and it absolutely isn't a viable defense for a general. Or for someone like Krupp.
- goodSteveramos 3y ago
  Firstly, Zyklon B is not “nerve gas” its cyanide that was manufactured as an insecticide to disinfect lice. If you have proof that the employees making it had knowledge of its use as a murder weapon please present it. Otherwise you are just going on a witch hunt to enact vengeance on people just for being German.
  - oezi 3y ago
    As a German I am a bit saddened that you are coming to defend some of the most murderous tools of mass annihilation. Zyklon A (the predecessor product) was banned after the first world war due to its use as a weapon in the war. And Bruno Tesch - the inventor of Zyklon B - was executed in 1946 for knowingly selling the product to the SS for use on humans (at least according to Wikipedia). In essence, the people in Germany knew very well what their leadership was doing and they supported it. Too few were ever held accountable. This is not about vengeance (there isn't such a concept in the modern justice systems, right?). It is about accountability for your own atrocities. Germans grow up learning this in the hope it can prevent another event like the Holocaust. This kind of accountability extends to everyone. Even scientists in the trenches who participate developing those technologies that might be misused.
    - goodSteveramos 3y ago
      Once again you just keep asserting things without any evidence and in its place attack anyone who asks for it as “defending murderers” as if that is a foregone conclusion. This is the logic of charlatans and liars my friend. Think a bit harder about why you believe these things and if it is evidence and not emotion share it with me please.
ok_dad 3y ago
[flagged]
eyelidlessness 3y ago
> The idea that people working for companies making basic supplies are guilty of murder for what their own government did with said supplies without their knowledge is so absurd That idea is absurd.
jpmoral 3y ago
@vkou mentioned industrialists, not rank-and-file employees.
- goodSteveramos 3y ago
  Ok. Can anyone name an industrialist and present evidence that he thought people were being murdered with his company’s products? If not this is just mindless lashing out at powerless Germans for losing the war.

oezi 3y ago

> without their knowledge I would beg to differ. The industrial magnates of this German era where all well aware of what their supplies were going towards: A 'total war' that didn't stop at exterminating anybody considered inferior. Each individual case is certainly difficult but there is a line where you can and should be tried as an employee for participating in something which violates laws and or ethical boundaries. And this doesn't apply only to the manufacturing of something like Zyklon B nerve gas.

KRAKRISMOTT 3y ago
Do you expect the executives of Raytheon and Lockheed to be put on trial if they lose a war too? You don't want to open that can of worms. Living by the sword is for soldiers and military, not for the civilian government. In the past, royalty who lost a battle were treated well and ransomed precisely to prevent blowback when the shoe is on the other foot.
- vkou 3y ago
  If the US starts a six-year war of extermination against Jews and Slavs and Roma and others, killing 30 million people, I think more than the executives of Raytheon should stand to lose their heads, but it would be a good start. It certainly wouldn't help their case if they also used slave labour, and bankrolled the fringe party that went ahead to seize power, and unleash that horror upon the world. 'Just following orders' isn't a valid defense for a lieutenant, and it absolutely isn't a viable defense for a general. Or for someone like Krupp.
goodSteveramos 3y ago
Firstly, Zyklon B is not “nerve gas” its cyanide that was manufactured as an insecticide to disinfect lice. If you have proof that the employees making it had knowledge of its use as a murder weapon please present it. Otherwise you are just going on a witch hunt to enact vengeance on people just for being German.
- oezi 3y ago
  As a German I am a bit saddened that you are coming to defend some of the most murderous tools of mass annihilation. Zyklon A (the predecessor product) was banned after the first world war due to its use as a weapon in the war. And Bruno Tesch - the inventor of Zyklon B - was executed in 1946 for knowingly selling the product to the SS for use on humans (at least according to Wikipedia). In essence, the people in Germany knew very well what their leadership was doing and they supported it. Too few were ever held accountable. This is not about vengeance (there isn't such a concept in the modern justice systems, right?). It is about accountability for your own atrocities. Germans grow up learning this in the hope it can prevent another event like the Holocaust. This kind of accountability extends to everyone. Even scientists in the trenches who participate developing those technologies that might be misused.
  - goodSteveramos 3y ago
    Once again you just keep asserting things without any evidence and in its place attack anyone who asks for it as “defending murderers” as if that is a foregone conclusion. This is the logic of charlatans and liars my friend. Think a bit harder about why you believe these things and if it is evidence and not emotion share it with me please.

ok_dad 3y ago

[flagged]

eyelidlessness 3y ago

> The idea that people working for companies making basic supplies are guilty of murder for what their own government did with said supplies without their knowledge is so absurd That idea is absurd.

jpmoral 3y ago

@vkou mentioned industrialists, not rank-and-file employees.

goodSteveramos 3y ago
Ok. Can anyone name an industrialist and present evidence that he thought people were being murdered with his company’s products? If not this is just mindless lashing out at powerless Germans for losing the war.