5 ms·

Do we have anything equivalent for AMD’s PSP?

bri3d 3y ago
The equivalent of Option 3, send a supported command that tells the runtime capabilities to shut down, has been provided as a user-selectable option by AMD in AGESA (the unified AMD BIOS/EFI package) for several years now. I haven't found anyone who has actually reversed the functionality to audit what it's doing, though.
- jacquesm 3y ago
  In a way this is all insane: we are spending a fortune on security globally but at the same time manufacturers get to insert massive backdoors into the hardware and hardly anybody bats an eye.
  - wmf 3y ago
    What if... ME/PSP are actually very low security risk relative to everything else in the system.
    - dboat 3y ago
      It's troubling to have even a potentially very low security risk in hardware I paid for being beyond my reach to resolve.
  - charcircuit 3y ago
    >manufacturers get to insert massive backdoors into the hardware There is no proof that they are >hardly anybody bats an eye. Because only a certain niche of paranoid people are willing to believe that companies are trying to make their systems intentionally insecure so that you can be personally hacked.
    - feanaro 3y ago
      It most certainly doesn't have to be intentionally insecure but it almost definitely is accidentally so. There should be no OS nor network stack running in the firmware, period.
      - fsflover 3y ago
        User-respecting OS running in the firmware can be really useful. It must be FLOSS though. Example: https://puri.sm/posts/pureboots-powerful-recovery-console/ https://puri.sm/posts/pureboots-powerful-recovery-console/.
    - anonymousiam 3y ago
      It's a fact that NSA solicits companies to add security weaknesses to their products. They'll "make an offer you can't refuse" by offering cash (in the form of a contract), and they'll use their influence with other "contractors" and government agencies to punish companies that don't participate. This is not unique to NSA. Security agencies within other governments play the same games with supply chains.
      - charcircuit 3y ago
        Intel making their products insecure is bad for their brand and bad for world wide computer security. Massive amounts of damage could happen by abusing such a backdoor. There is plenty of evidence of Intel claiming that there are no backdoors in their products, but there isn't for some NSA deal for adding a backdoor.
        nailer 3y ago
        Pardon? Snowden showed huge amounts of NSA backdoors. It’s probably worth limiting the conversation to what they don’t have access to rather than trying to enumerate what they do have access to.
    - jacquesm 3y ago
      You must have slept through Snowden.
- jacooper 3y ago
  This is probably going to change when AMD switches from AGESA openSIL, fully open firmware.

The equivalent of Option 3, send a supported command that tells the runtime capabilities to shut down, has been provided as a user-selectable option by AMD in AGESA (the unified AMD BIOS/EFI package) for several years now. I haven't found anyone who has actually reversed the functionality to audit what it's doing, though.

jacquesm 3y ago
In a way this is all insane: we are spending a fortune on security globally but at the same time manufacturers get to insert massive backdoors into the hardware and hardly anybody bats an eye.
- wmf 3y ago
  What if... ME/PSP are actually very low security risk relative to everything else in the system.
  - dboat 3y ago
    It's troubling to have even a potentially very low security risk in hardware I paid for being beyond my reach to resolve.
- charcircuit 3y ago
  >manufacturers get to insert massive backdoors into the hardware There is no proof that they are >hardly anybody bats an eye. Because only a certain niche of paranoid people are willing to believe that companies are trying to make their systems intentionally insecure so that you can be personally hacked.
  - feanaro 3y ago
    It most certainly doesn't have to be intentionally insecure but it almost definitely is accidentally so. There should be no OS nor network stack running in the firmware, period.
    - fsflover 3y ago
      User-respecting OS running in the firmware can be really useful. It must be FLOSS though. Example: https://puri.sm/posts/pureboots-powerful-recovery-console/ https://puri.sm/posts/pureboots-powerful-recovery-console/.
  - anonymousiam 3y ago
    It's a fact that NSA solicits companies to add security weaknesses to their products. They'll "make an offer you can't refuse" by offering cash (in the form of a contract), and they'll use their influence with other "contractors" and government agencies to punish companies that don't participate. This is not unique to NSA. Security agencies within other governments play the same games with supply chains.
    - charcircuit 3y ago
      Intel making their products insecure is bad for their brand and bad for world wide computer security. Massive amounts of damage could happen by abusing such a backdoor. There is plenty of evidence of Intel claiming that there are no backdoors in their products, but there isn't for some NSA deal for adding a backdoor.
      - nailer 3y ago
        Pardon? Snowden showed huge amounts of NSA backdoors. It’s probably worth limiting the conversation to what they don’t have access to rather than trying to enumerate what they do have access to.
  - jacquesm 3y ago
    You must have slept through Snowden.
jacooper 3y ago
This is probably going to change when AMD switches from AGESA openSIL, fully open firmware.