3 ms·

They also rely on medieval era trees to reconstruct it, as the more than 1000 oak trees painstakingly sought through entire France had to be more than 1 m wide.

by soco 3y ago

They also rely on medieval era trees to reconstruct it, as the more than 1000 oak trees painstakingly sought through entire France had to be more than 1 m wide. Okay not medieval - they are only about 200 years old. Could have made a nice title though.

Fiahil 3y ago
Between 200 and 400 years old, yes, exactly ! Most of those trees are older than the United States :)
shagie 3y ago
There's the story by the Long Now foundation about the oak beams at the New College in Oxford https://longnow.org/ideas/humans-and-trees-in-long-term-partnership/ https://longnow.org/ideas/humans-and-trees-in-long-term-part... /// https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-ox... /// https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2013/oct/02/david-cameron-oxford-college-trees-myth https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2013/oct/02/david-... Another example (and less debatable in its authenticity) Why the US Navy Manages Its Own Private Forest - https://www.military.com/history/why-us-navy-manages-its-own-private-forest.html https://www.military.com/history/why-us-navy-manages-its-own... /// https://ussconstitutionmuseum.org/2015/05/11/the-wooden-walls/ https://ussconstitutionmuseum.org/2015/05/11/the-wooden-wall... (and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28793461 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28793461 )
- kryptiskt 3y ago
  In the 1950s, Lund Cathedral bought the quarries where the stone for it originally came 900 years ago, so they know they have a source of the right stone for renovations.
franky47 3y ago
We have a forest in the center of France that was dedicated to producing ship masts. Surely some of those oak trees may have fit the bill. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forest_of_Tron%C3%A7ais https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forest_of_Tron%C3%A7ais
mcdonje 3y ago
That's really sad. What a shame cutting down 1k large old oaks for any building at all. It's not necessary these days. Of course they need some wood in publicly viewable areas, but this amount of not only wood but large old oak trees is excessive and concerning. Is there any indication that they're improving the structure so it will be more fire proof? Or are they simply restoring it to the configuration that already failed?
- hackernewds 3y ago
  The cutting down of 1000 year oaks is sad. Perhaps we can have the perspective that these trees lived fulfilling lives and the younger trees deserve centuries? And after all the Notre Dame is also a very historically significant building
- kelsolaar 3y ago
  The cathedral has been up for hundreds of years, hard to qualify that as a failure.
  - mcdonje 3y ago
    Not exactly in its most recent configuration that failed. The people in charge are so concerned about historical accuracy they need to cut down a thousand large oaks, but their predecessors weren't so concerned about historical accuracy when they retrofitted a medieval structure with the electrical wiring that ended up causing it to burn down.
    - hef19898 3y ago
      Lucky for Notre Dame, HN is not charge of reconstruction...
    - kelsolaar 3y ago
      The wiring that were installed in the oak structure, if they are the cause for a short that ultimately caused the fire, were contrary to regulation in the first place and were only meant to be installed temporarily. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre-Dame_fire https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre-Dame_fire
lgvld 3y ago
My grand mother [1] has tracked down many of those oaks and produced imprints [2] of their barks as a tribute to the trees and also to the (both public and private) owners of the forests in which the trees have been cut. At least 1k oaks were harvested from forests everywhere in France. [3] The majority of them were given for free to help in the rebuilding, and trees of this age/dimensions/quality are definitely not cheap. Both the cutting and moving of such trees -- between 6 and 13 meters, up to 15 tons! -- requires careful planning and flawless execution as they need to be taken out of the forests and preserved during their journey to the sawmill [4] in the North of France. (Here is also an interview of the sawmill operators [5].) Crazy and fascinating project involving several rare craftsmanships. (Everything is written in French below.) [1] https://www.onf.fr/onf/+/bcf::constance-fulda-larbre-dans-la-peau.html https://www.onf.fr/onf/+/bcf::constance-fulda-larbre-dans-la... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv38f3m3f2k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv38f3m3f2k [3] https://actu.fr/ile-de-france/ferrieres-en-brie_77181/notre-dame-de-paris-58-chenes-de-ferrieres-formeront-la-charpente-de-la-fleche_44958251.html https://actu.fr/ile-de-france/ferrieres-en-brie_77181/notre-... [4] https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/1876802/france-notre-dame-cathedrale-chenes https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/1876802/france-notre-da... [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQtxUsU9T2Y&t=63s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQtxUsU9T2Y&t=63s [bonus] https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%A9bardage https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%A9bardage

by soco 3y ago

Fiahil 3y ago

Between 200 and 400 years old, yes, exactly ! Most of those trees are older than the United States :)

shagie 3y ago

There's the story by the Long Now foundation about the oak beams at the New College in Oxford https://longnow.org/ideas/humans-and-trees-in-long-term-partnership/ https://longnow.org/ideas/humans-and-trees-in-long-term-part... /// https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-ox... /// https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2013/oct/02/david-cameron-oxford-college-trees-myth https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2013/oct/02/david-... Another example (and less debatable in its authenticity) Why the US Navy Manages Its Own Private Forest - https://www.military.com/history/why-us-navy-manages-its-own-private-forest.html https://www.military.com/history/why-us-navy-manages-its-own... /// https://ussconstitutionmuseum.org/2015/05/11/the-wooden-walls/ https://ussconstitutionmuseum.org/2015/05/11/the-wooden-wall... (and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28793461 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28793461 )

kryptiskt 3y ago
In the 1950s, Lund Cathedral bought the quarries where the stone for it originally came 900 years ago, so they know they have a source of the right stone for renovations.

franky47 3y ago

We have a forest in the center of France that was dedicated to producing ship masts. Surely some of those oak trees may have fit the bill. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forest_of_Tron%C3%A7ais https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forest_of_Tron%C3%A7ais

mcdonje 3y ago

That's really sad. What a shame cutting down 1k large old oaks for any building at all. It's not necessary these days. Of course they need some wood in publicly viewable areas, but this amount of not only wood but large old oak trees is excessive and concerning. Is there any indication that they're improving the structure so it will be more fire proof? Or are they simply restoring it to the configuration that already failed?

hackernewds 3y ago
The cutting down of 1000 year oaks is sad. Perhaps we can have the perspective that these trees lived fulfilling lives and the younger trees deserve centuries? And after all the Notre Dame is also a very historically significant building
kelsolaar 3y ago
The cathedral has been up for hundreds of years, hard to qualify that as a failure.
- mcdonje 3y ago
  Not exactly in its most recent configuration that failed. The people in charge are so concerned about historical accuracy they need to cut down a thousand large oaks, but their predecessors weren't so concerned about historical accuracy when they retrofitted a medieval structure with the electrical wiring that ended up causing it to burn down.
  - hef19898 3y ago
    Lucky for Notre Dame, HN is not charge of reconstruction...
  - kelsolaar 3y ago
    The wiring that were installed in the oak structure, if they are the cause for a short that ultimately caused the fire, were contrary to regulation in the first place and were only meant to be installed temporarily. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre-Dame_fire https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre-Dame_fire

lgvld 3y ago

My grand mother [1] has tracked down many of those oaks and produced imprints [2] of their barks as a tribute to the trees and also to the (both public and private) owners of the forests in which the trees have been cut. At least 1k oaks were harvested from forests everywhere in France. [3] The majority of them were given for free to help in the rebuilding, and trees of this age/dimensions/quality are definitely not cheap. Both the cutting and moving of such trees -- between 6 and 13 meters, up to 15 tons! -- requires careful planning and flawless execution as they need to be taken out of the forests and preserved during their journey to the sawmill [4] in the North of France. (Here is also an interview of the sawmill operators [5].) Crazy and fascinating project involving several rare craftsmanships. (Everything is written in French below.) [1] https://www.onf.fr/onf/+/bcf::constance-fulda-larbre-dans-la-peau.html https://www.onf.fr/onf/+/bcf::constance-fulda-larbre-dans-la... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv38f3m3f2k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv38f3m3f2k [3] https://actu.fr/ile-de-france/ferrieres-en-brie_77181/notre-dame-de-paris-58-chenes-de-ferrieres-formeront-la-charpente-de-la-fleche_44958251.html https://actu.fr/ile-de-france/ferrieres-en-brie_77181/notre-... [4] https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/1876802/france-notre-dame-cathedrale-chenes https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/1876802/france-notre-da... [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQtxUsU9T2Y&t=63s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQtxUsU9T2Y&t=63s [bonus] https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%A9bardage https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%A9bardage