3 ms·

There are enough phone projects, and they are hard. I much rather have a laptop project and that's what they are working on.

nazgulsenpai 3y ago
No, I agree. I don't expect it would or even should happen, but if it did I would be very interested.
PopePompus 3y ago
Yes, building a cell phone is simply something a small group of people cannot do successfully. I used to develop software for Openmoko phones, the N900, and other early Linux phones. Those projects had several decedent projects, all of which failed. There are several show-stoppers: 1) chip vendors won't talk to you if you are proposing to build a few thousand phones. 2) These projects never produce several iterations of prototypes that are tested by a significant number of users, so if they ever do ship a phone, there are terrible hardware faults. Fun fact: end users are not good at adding additional surface-mount components to cure these problems. 3) Unless you are making an Android phone, or at least an Android-compatible phone, none of the major apps will be available, and your customer base will be limited to the small fraction of the population that cares about privacy. So you'll never see economies of scale. 4) It will take longer than expected to bring the phone to the market, so even if you manage to build something, the hardware will be several generations behind what consumers expect. 5) Power management is hard.
- donkeybeer 3y ago
  Whats the minimum volume of units do you think is necessary to get them interested?
- jancsika 3y ago
  > chip vendors won't talk to you if you are proposing to build a few thousand phones. So is all the bootleg crazy hardware produced and sold in Shenzhen basically running the same firmware/driver blobs used in the West? Is there really nobody who has access to specs for even out-of-date shitty cameras, wifi modules, and old gpus?
  - PopePompus 3y ago
    The thing is, if you build a phone out of shitty old components that the manufacturers no longer care about, who's gonna buy it?
- panick21_ 3y ago
  I was all in on OpenMoko before I knew anything about these topics. First big disappointment in terms of hardware projects. Cool that you worked on that. I'm less optimistic on projects now but a lot respect for people who tried to do that work. To bad the whole Nokia N900 thing didn't work.
Brian_K_White 3y ago
Still waiting years for my FxTec. By the time it arrives I asssume I will be unimpressed with a snapdragon 662. Qualcom EOLed the snapdragon 835 it was originally based on, so mid-way, they had to redesign around a newer but lower spec chip. The original chip was a high end but from 2017. Imagine getting that, new, in 2023 or 2024. In some ways I guess I don't care since I'm on a pixel 4a 5g just for the headphone jack. But I also only paid about 150 or 200 for it.

nazgulsenpai 3y ago

No, I agree. I don't expect it would or even should happen, but if it did I would be very interested.

PopePompus 3y ago

Yes, building a cell phone is simply something a small group of people cannot do successfully. I used to develop software for Openmoko phones, the N900, and other early Linux phones. Those projects had several decedent projects, all of which failed. There are several show-stoppers: 1) chip vendors won't talk to you if you are proposing to build a few thousand phones. 2) These projects never produce several iterations of prototypes that are tested by a significant number of users, so if they ever do ship a phone, there are terrible hardware faults. Fun fact: end users are not good at adding additional surface-mount components to cure these problems. 3) Unless you are making an Android phone, or at least an Android-compatible phone, none of the major apps will be available, and your customer base will be limited to the small fraction of the population that cares about privacy. So you'll never see economies of scale. 4) It will take longer than expected to bring the phone to the market, so even if you manage to build something, the hardware will be several generations behind what consumers expect. 5) Power management is hard.

donkeybeer 3y ago
Whats the minimum volume of units do you think is necessary to get them interested?
jancsika 3y ago
> chip vendors won't talk to you if you are proposing to build a few thousand phones. So is all the bootleg crazy hardware produced and sold in Shenzhen basically running the same firmware/driver blobs used in the West? Is there really nobody who has access to specs for even out-of-date shitty cameras, wifi modules, and old gpus?
- PopePompus 3y ago
  The thing is, if you build a phone out of shitty old components that the manufacturers no longer care about, who's gonna buy it?
panick21_ 3y ago
I was all in on OpenMoko before I knew anything about these topics. First big disappointment in terms of hardware projects. Cool that you worked on that. I'm less optimistic on projects now but a lot respect for people who tried to do that work. To bad the whole Nokia N900 thing didn't work.

Brian_K_White 3y ago

Still waiting years for my FxTec. By the time it arrives I asssume I will be unimpressed with a snapdragon 662. Qualcom EOLed the snapdragon 835 it was originally based on, so mid-way, they had to redesign around a newer but lower spec chip. The original chip was a high end but from 2017. Imagine getting that, new, in 2023 or 2024. In some ways I guess I don't care since I'm on a pixel 4a 5g just for the headphone jack. But I also only paid about 150 or 200 for it.