4 ms·

Yandex = FSB (former KGB) why? An oversimplification, yes, but people should be more careful. Current security services in Russia haven't really changed much

by hastur 15y ago

Yandex = FSB (former KGB) why? An oversimplification, yes, but people should be more careful. Current security services in Russia haven't really changed much since the Soviet times, except they are more "capitalistic" in their motivations. Actually, the top people are all former officers of the Soviet apparatus, except now they have a bigger taste not only for power, but for money too. There is no big company in Russia that wouldn't need "protection" from the services and in result wouldn't share its profits and wouldn't do the services' bidding. For instance, if Yandex has any preferential access to Twitter servers or data, you can be sure the FSB has it too. And Russian security services are no benevolent protector of Russian citizens. They are effectively an organized crime network, acting with impunity at home and with state resources abroad. For further research, I encourage everyone to google: russia mafia state. And only go to credible sources, like The Economist and The Guardian.

nodata 15y ago
> Yandex = FSB (former KGB) Can you show us some evidence?
- hastur 15y ago
  Can you please read my comment in full? Evidence of what? I've said immediately below that it's an oversimplification, as you must obviously realize, intended to catch peoples' attention? Or do you want me to provide evidence that: - Yandex is a significant Russian firm (possibly biggest in terms of foreign investments in IT) - Russian state, and security services in particular, can easily exercise almost any kind of control on any Russian business (and put those who resist in jail on made up accusations) - Russian security services are highly corrupt, interlinked with organized crime, and pursuant of their own self interests. For that you just need to read a bit on the topics. And again, not some conspiracy hallucinations, but the most credible sources of journalism. (Or perhaps you're one of those people, who think that Litvinenko died from food poisoning? ;)
  - nodata 15y ago
    Saying "Yandex = FSB (former KGB)" is different from saying that "Yandex is a Russian company. Russian companies rely on the Russian State. The Russian State is corrupt and linked to Russian security services." > (Or perhaps you're one of those people, who think that Litvinenko died from food poisoning? ;) Yawn.
ellynix 15y ago
How do you know for sure Yandex have protection of KGB? Is it your imagination and tendency to generalize russian political mess over big IT company? Or you know the facts (some Yandex insides, for example)?
- hastur 15y ago
  I can't know for sure, but if you know enough about the realities of that environment, you realize it's almost inevitable. Yandex is too tasty of a prey, and the security services are too powerful. [And I don't even know what you mean by "political mess". Street protests are very recent, while the security apparatus had its way pretty much since Putin took power. There is no mess, there's Putin for 12 years now (and his temporary stand-in, Medvedev).]
  - ellynix 15y ago
    I apologize for using the wrong words. I meant situation around uncontrolled corruption in every aspect of russian citizen's life. Please, would you be so intelligent not to state things of which you are not sure? I'm russian and Yandex employee since 2008. There's a lot of smart people doing cool things because they like to. That's how Yandex doing it's business. Some of yandexers openly considered with government influence over big (mostly petroleum) companies, some prefer to keep their liberal views in silence. I'm sure many employees will quit Yandex as soon as it would be involved in cooperation with KGB.
    - hastur 15y ago
      I have absolutely no quarrel or suspicion of the average Yandex employee. I'm sure the company is filled with intelligent and well-intentioned people. But surely you must realize, you would have no idea if the security services had exerted some form of control over your company. If there is any control, and I'll insist there almost certainly is, there's a handful of people who know about it. And they won't tell you, because they are the very ones controlled and too concerned about their job, freedom or personal safety. So while obviously you can't say that Yandex _is_ FSB, I'd say you can pretty much assume that Twitter giving some privileged access to its data to Yandex is equivalent to giving privileged access to Russian intelligence. "Please, would you be so intelligent not to state things of which you are not sure?" - Well, if all we cared about were raw, 100% confirmed facts, we should abandon any form of discussion and just read news. For instance, what good is advice for entrepreneurs, when it's just conclusions and generalizations drawn from someone's narrow experience? No, the whole point of having a sensible discussion is to actually draw conclusions, challenge them and reassess. And as I said earlier, Yandex is too important and too influential in the tech sphere (from Russian perspective) not to draw interest from the security services. Considering their enormous power and impunity, I find it almost certain that they would use Yandex for their own benefit. With appropriate care and discretion, of course, otherwise it defies the purpose.
myth_drannon 15y ago
Google = CIA , Facebook = CIA , RIM = CIA duh.
- hastur 15y ago
  The CIA has nowhere near as much control over those businesses, it's limited by all kinds of legal obstacles and procedures. The FSB can do almost anything they want. Also, the CIA has a mission dictated by the US govt. You can disagree with US policies, or find some practices of US intelligence community objectionable, but that doesn't compare to the motivations of Russian security services. Which are indeed hardly different than those of your typical mafia boss: Amass wealth and influence, by any means necessary, while staying out of the spotlight. Except: their means are way beyond anything any mafia could dream of.

by hastur 15y ago

nodata 15y ago

> Yandex = FSB (former KGB) Can you show us some evidence?

hastur 15y ago
Can you please read my comment in full? Evidence of what? I've said immediately below that it's an oversimplification, as you must obviously realize, intended to catch peoples' attention? Or do you want me to provide evidence that: - Yandex is a significant Russian firm (possibly biggest in terms of foreign investments in IT) - Russian state, and security services in particular, can easily exercise almost any kind of control on any Russian business (and put those who resist in jail on made up accusations) - Russian security services are highly corrupt, interlinked with organized crime, and pursuant of their own self interests. For that you just need to read a bit on the topics. And again, not some conspiracy hallucinations, but the most credible sources of journalism. (Or perhaps you're one of those people, who think that Litvinenko died from food poisoning? ;)
- nodata 15y ago
  Saying "Yandex = FSB (former KGB)" is different from saying that "Yandex is a Russian company. Russian companies rely on the Russian State. The Russian State is corrupt and linked to Russian security services." > (Or perhaps you're one of those people, who think that Litvinenko died from food poisoning? ;) Yawn.

ellynix 15y ago

How do you know for sure Yandex have protection of KGB? Is it your imagination and tendency to generalize russian political mess over big IT company? Or you know the facts (some Yandex insides, for example)?

hastur 15y ago
I can't know for sure, but if you know enough about the realities of that environment, you realize it's almost inevitable. Yandex is too tasty of a prey, and the security services are too powerful. [And I don't even know what you mean by "political mess". Street protests are very recent, while the security apparatus had its way pretty much since Putin took power. There is no mess, there's Putin for 12 years now (and his temporary stand-in, Medvedev).]
- ellynix 15y ago
  I apologize for using the wrong words. I meant situation around uncontrolled corruption in every aspect of russian citizen's life. Please, would you be so intelligent not to state things of which you are not sure? I'm russian and Yandex employee since 2008. There's a lot of smart people doing cool things because they like to. That's how Yandex doing it's business. Some of yandexers openly considered with government influence over big (mostly petroleum) companies, some prefer to keep their liberal views in silence. I'm sure many employees will quit Yandex as soon as it would be involved in cooperation with KGB.
  - hastur 15y ago
    I have absolutely no quarrel or suspicion of the average Yandex employee. I'm sure the company is filled with intelligent and well-intentioned people. But surely you must realize, you would have no idea if the security services had exerted some form of control over your company. If there is any control, and I'll insist there almost certainly is, there's a handful of people who know about it. And they won't tell you, because they are the very ones controlled and too concerned about their job, freedom or personal safety. So while obviously you can't say that Yandex _is_ FSB, I'd say you can pretty much assume that Twitter giving some privileged access to its data to Yandex is equivalent to giving privileged access to Russian intelligence. "Please, would you be so intelligent not to state things of which you are not sure?" - Well, if all we cared about were raw, 100% confirmed facts, we should abandon any form of discussion and just read news. For instance, what good is advice for entrepreneurs, when it's just conclusions and generalizations drawn from someone's narrow experience? No, the whole point of having a sensible discussion is to actually draw conclusions, challenge them and reassess. And as I said earlier, Yandex is too important and too influential in the tech sphere (from Russian perspective) not to draw interest from the security services. Considering their enormous power and impunity, I find it almost certain that they would use Yandex for their own benefit. With appropriate care and discretion, of course, otherwise it defies the purpose.

myth_drannon 15y ago

Google = CIA , Facebook = CIA , RIM = CIA duh.

hastur 15y ago
The CIA has nowhere near as much control over those businesses, it's limited by all kinds of legal obstacles and procedures. The FSB can do almost anything they want. Also, the CIA has a mission dictated by the US govt. You can disagree with US policies, or find some practices of US intelligence community objectionable, but that doesn't compare to the motivations of Russian security services. Which are indeed hardly different than those of your typical mafia boss: Amass wealth and influence, by any means necessary, while staying out of the spotlight. Except: their means are way beyond anything any mafia could dream of.