3 ms·

Not being fluent in any languages other than my native tongue, I always feel that I can't really get to grips with a culture without knowing the language. I f

by downx3 15y ago

Not being fluent in any languages other than my native tongue, I always feel that I can't really get to grips with a culture without knowing the language. I find some language - and phrasing quite revealing and beautiful. I love listening to other languages - even if I don't understand them.

Tichy 15y ago
I don't mind other languages. Maybe my problem is that there isn't really any other culture I would like to immerse in. Most cultures seem to be all about oppression. I am happy to live in a moderately free world, which also happens to have a high fraction of English speakers. For example, I might consider learning Mandarin. China sure is fascinating, but I sure as hell wouldn't like to live there. So what would I gain, really? The ability to read some fascinating ancient texts. OK - but as I said, I can imagine better uses of my time. What would be a an interesting country to immerse in? Most Spanish speaking countries are poor and dangerous. The muslim world suppresses women and is also dangerous, and I could get killed for twittering. Russia? Also too poor, cold and depressing. Japan perhaps, but it is a rather small island and I am probably too tall to ever live there comfortably. I already live in Europe and there are other European countries I like, but not enough to learn the languages. If I were to move to some obscure EU country, I would of course try to learn their language. But it seems unlikely atm, so why bother?
- downx3 15y ago
  I think you have to be slightly careful with your sweeping generalisations! I think culture transcends the state. The citizens of a country don't necessarily represent the state do they?
  - Tichy 15y ago
    Of course there are nice people everywhere. But there are nice people at home, too. What would be a nice country to visit? That is my question? Take China - it is fascinating, but they don't have free speech and lots of death sentences. That makes it very unattractive to me. Even if I could meet interesting people there, chances are the interesting stuff would be illegal to say. So if I talk about it, I put myself at risk. At other countries, you don't even meet women on the street. Sure, they might be really nice, but why do all the work to get beyond "culture"? In a lot of countries, if I talk to a woman her brothers might set out to kill me. Additionally, I am not keen on any kind of religion to begin with. I wrote my rant in the hopes that somebody would come up with a good reason to learn a language or visit "challenged" countries. I am aware that the Euro zone is a small bubble of moderate happiness on a sea of misery. I am lucky - but why should I leave the bubble and put myself at risk? Or even if I don't put myself at risk, chances are I am just taking advantage of some poor people (because I would travel to some holiday resort because it is so cheap). Unfortunately historically culture tends to be all about suppressing women, among other things, I am just not into it. It is a set of rules, why should I force myself into it? I want to be free from culture, and I want to meet people who are free minds. Can you name one worthwhile culture to get to know, and why is it worthwhile? Apart from scientific studies, which are fascinating, but not my line of work. Clothes are the same all over the world now. Food you can also get a huge variety in most major cities. Nothing against traveling to the odd country, but then again it is questionable if traveling to some country once for two weeks warrants investing years to learn their language.
    - downx3 15y ago
      > chances are I am just taking advantage of some poor people (because I would travel to some holiday resort because it is so cheap) Those of us in the 'west' are doing this anyway through food and goods. Sounds like you'd prefer some kind of ethical tourism. As a note of optimism, history is there to be learnt from. Not very long ago did we see women and blacks oppressed in the so called civilised world.

by downx3 15y ago

Tichy 15y ago

I don't mind other languages. Maybe my problem is that there isn't really any other culture I would like to immerse in. Most cultures seem to be all about oppression. I am happy to live in a moderately free world, which also happens to have a high fraction of English speakers. For example, I might consider learning Mandarin. China sure is fascinating, but I sure as hell wouldn't like to live there. So what would I gain, really? The ability to read some fascinating ancient texts. OK - but as I said, I can imagine better uses of my time. What would be a an interesting country to immerse in? Most Spanish speaking countries are poor and dangerous. The muslim world suppresses women and is also dangerous, and I could get killed for twittering. Russia? Also too poor, cold and depressing. Japan perhaps, but it is a rather small island and I am probably too tall to ever live there comfortably. I already live in Europe and there are other European countries I like, but not enough to learn the languages. If I were to move to some obscure EU country, I would of course try to learn their language. But it seems unlikely atm, so why bother?

downx3 15y ago
I think you have to be slightly careful with your sweeping generalisations! I think culture transcends the state. The citizens of a country don't necessarily represent the state do they?
- Tichy 15y ago
  Of course there are nice people everywhere. But there are nice people at home, too. What would be a nice country to visit? That is my question? Take China - it is fascinating, but they don't have free speech and lots of death sentences. That makes it very unattractive to me. Even if I could meet interesting people there, chances are the interesting stuff would be illegal to say. So if I talk about it, I put myself at risk. At other countries, you don't even meet women on the street. Sure, they might be really nice, but why do all the work to get beyond "culture"? In a lot of countries, if I talk to a woman her brothers might set out to kill me. Additionally, I am not keen on any kind of religion to begin with. I wrote my rant in the hopes that somebody would come up with a good reason to learn a language or visit "challenged" countries. I am aware that the Euro zone is a small bubble of moderate happiness on a sea of misery. I am lucky - but why should I leave the bubble and put myself at risk? Or even if I don't put myself at risk, chances are I am just taking advantage of some poor people (because I would travel to some holiday resort because it is so cheap). Unfortunately historically culture tends to be all about suppressing women, among other things, I am just not into it. It is a set of rules, why should I force myself into it? I want to be free from culture, and I want to meet people who are free minds. Can you name one worthwhile culture to get to know, and why is it worthwhile? Apart from scientific studies, which are fascinating, but not my line of work. Clothes are the same all over the world now. Food you can also get a huge variety in most major cities. Nothing against traveling to the odd country, but then again it is questionable if traveling to some country once for two weeks warrants investing years to learn their language.
  - downx3 15y ago
    > chances are I am just taking advantage of some poor people (because I would travel to some holiday resort because it is so cheap) Those of us in the 'west' are doing this anyway through food and goods. Sounds like you'd prefer some kind of ethical tourism. As a note of optimism, history is there to be learnt from. Not very long ago did we see women and blacks oppressed in the so called civilised world.