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OP, is your only experience working with technology companies and trendy startups trying to hit some mega-million valuation? The real world is a lot more messy

OP, is your only experience working with technology companies and trendy startups trying to hit some mega-million valuation? The real world is a lot more messy than the best practices that tech companies come up with. Go work for some local warehouse or AC repair company's IT departments. They might have some technology for managing inventory or scheduling appointments or billing or any one of a hundred tasks that isn't done in the most modern way. There's many industries where technology isn't valued or emphasized and that are still using code and some practices from 10-15+ years ago due to financial constraints. And that's fine, as long as it works and is secure. Many times it isn't, but it can work just fine even if it doesn't look modern. I'd bet the vast majority of websites out there are not using containers today. I'd bet there's some pretty big and profitable websites out there that probably deploy stuff via uploading a bunch of files via SFTP (or even FTP) and perhaps running some deployment script that's been hacked together a decade ago. Hell, we talk a lot about the market being consumed by React and languages like Python. But jQuery is still ridiculously widely used. PHP is basically persona non-grata on HN, but its market share among overall websites is still pretty high. I'm kind of mad that the community here killed codevark's answer because that's an example of the messy world we live in that gives a partial answer to OP's question.

koliber 3y ago
I've been in the industry for 20+ years. My opinion is that the extra complexity that comes from containarization is not necessary at many of the early startups. The benefits are not needed and the costs are hard to see but non-trivial. The companies I worked with either were slowly moving towards containarization, or were already there before I joined. I always thought that it is premature. My pet projects never used it, and I had well-running pipelines, zero-downtime, and 1-click deployments. I asked the question because I feel that I may be missing something. Perhaps the world moved on and I'm a curmudgeon, screaming at all the container-kids to get off my lawn. I recently started a little project and realized that I am not aware of what the current best practices around CI/CD are if you want to go down the route of "no containers, for now". I'm also at a point where I may be starting a new bigger project and would like to make sure I am putting in modern infra, but not necessarily pre-building and pushing containers to production.
- logicalmonster 3y ago
  A lot of "best development practices" exist as ways to ensure that multiple developers can all easily pickup a new project and collaborate on it successfully without conflicts. Yeah, go hog-wild and do whatever makes you happy as a solo act, so long as you do things securely and protect your users. By definition, there's no conflict between developers possible. You might pay a price later if you do things your way and get too successful, but that's a better problem to have than being too late to market with your great idea just because you were trying to do things "the right way".
- screwturner68 3y ago
  I almost never see CI/CD and less than 50% use containers and I'm at a different site every few weeks. That said maybe it's because I deal with highly regulated companies that don't like change and large entities where doing anything can take months so the idea of spinning vms up and down at will is not really needed or allowed. This is just what I see, not saying it's a trend, just what I see.
ano88888 3y ago
just like you said, 'it isn't valued or emphazied..' , meaning they won't be willing to pay you well.

koliber 3y ago

I've been in the industry for 20+ years. My opinion is that the extra complexity that comes from containarization is not necessary at many of the early startups. The benefits are not needed and the costs are hard to see but non-trivial. The companies I worked with either were slowly moving towards containarization, or were already there before I joined. I always thought that it is premature. My pet projects never used it, and I had well-running pipelines, zero-downtime, and 1-click deployments. I asked the question because I feel that I may be missing something. Perhaps the world moved on and I'm a curmudgeon, screaming at all the container-kids to get off my lawn. I recently started a little project and realized that I am not aware of what the current best practices around CI/CD are if you want to go down the route of "no containers, for now". I'm also at a point where I may be starting a new bigger project and would like to make sure I am putting in modern infra, but not necessarily pre-building and pushing containers to production.

logicalmonster 3y ago
A lot of "best development practices" exist as ways to ensure that multiple developers can all easily pickup a new project and collaborate on it successfully without conflicts. Yeah, go hog-wild and do whatever makes you happy as a solo act, so long as you do things securely and protect your users. By definition, there's no conflict between developers possible. You might pay a price later if you do things your way and get too successful, but that's a better problem to have than being too late to market with your great idea just because you were trying to do things "the right way".
screwturner68 3y ago
I almost never see CI/CD and less than 50% use containers and I'm at a different site every few weeks. That said maybe it's because I deal with highly regulated companies that don't like change and large entities where doing anything can take months so the idea of spinning vms up and down at will is not really needed or allowed. This is just what I see, not saying it's a trend, just what I see.

ano88888 3y ago

just like you said, 'it isn't valued or emphazied..' , meaning they won't be willing to pay you well.