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What they can and have done about it is to redirect their trade towards non western countries that constitute the majority of the world. Plenty of recent articl

What they can and have done about it is to redirect their trade towards non western countries that constitute the majority of the world. Plenty of recent articles clearly show that the sanctions have been an utter failure in practice. The only entity that's being severely hurt here is Europe. https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/02/23/world/russia-ukraine-geopolitics.html https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com... https://archive.ph/Niqwh https://archive.ph/Niqwh https://nationalinterest.org/feature/can-we-please-stop-comparing-russia%E2%80%99s-economy-italy%E2%80%99s-206404 https://nationalinterest.org/feature/can-we-please-stop-comp... https://www.reuters.com/markets/europe/russian-economy-ministry-improves-2023-gdp-growth-forecast-2023-04-14/ https://www.reuters.com/markets/europe/russian-economy-minis... https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/may/21/the-west-tightening-russian-sanctions-a-sign-of-failure https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/may/21/the-west-ti...

The_Colonel 3y ago
It's kind of funny to hear Russians argue how sanctions utterly failed, they are hurting the West, do not hurt Russia, on the opposite only strengthen it ... There's a saying "never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake", yet it seems Russians do exactly that again and again?
- yogthos 3y ago
  This isn't the Russians arguing, this is mainstream western pres saying this.
  - The_Colonel 3y ago
    Hand-picked to fit your agenda. No need to link the sources which disagree, right? Also, this link selection is provided by a Russian, so the point still stands.
    - yogthos 3y ago
      The only person with an agenda here is the one who keep using ad hominem attacks instead of providing any actual arguments. The reality is that the economic war has gone on for nearly two years now, and so far there is no sign of Russian economy collapsing. The sources I've provided come from mainstream western publications which are openly hostile to Russia, and they explain in black and white why the economic war has failed. I guess some people just aren't capable of engaging with reality.
      - The_Colonel 3y ago
        A person without an agenda would surely link also links which provide a different POV: * https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/12/01/ukraine-russia-sanctions-economy-war-putin-embargo-technology-financial-energy/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/12/01/ukraine-russia-sanction... * https://www.intereconomics.eu/contents/year/2023/number/1/article/why-sanctions-against-russia-work.html https://www.intereconomics.eu/contents/year/2023/number/1/ar... * https://www.csis.org/analysis/russia-sanctions-one-year https://www.csis.org/analysis/russia-sanctions-one-year Nobody claims the sanctions are perfect. Sometimes there are holes which need to be plugged. There are some other areas which should be sanctioned. The West should of course work on making the sanctions harder hitting.
        yogthos 3y ago
        It's pretty weird to claim that providing articles with the information that supports the points I'm making is an agenda. The problem with the claims in the articles you linked make is that they're at odds with the reality we're currently observing. There has been no evidence that Russia's war in Ukraine has been negatively impacted by the sanctions, and the predictions we hear every month that Russia is going to run out of weapons are not coming true either. Meanwhile, economy in Russia appears to be doing just fine because the void that western companies left is being filled by companies from China and India. The whole premise of your argument seems to be based on the notion that countries can't have an economy that's independent from the west. This is an absurd idea given that the west accounts for only 20% of world's population. Majority of the world sharply disagrees with the west as studies commissioned by EU and US clearly show: https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-rest-global-public-opinion-one-year-into-russias-war-on-ukraine/ https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-res... https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the-ukraine-war-viewed-from-the-global-south/ https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the... And here's how NYT puts it: > A year on, it’s becoming clearer: While the West’s core coalition remains remarkably solid, it never convinced the rest of the world to isolate Russia. https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/02/23/world/russia-ukraine-geopolitics.html https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com... What ultimately matters is the relative damage the sanctions are causing to Russia and Europe. There is clear evidence that there has been sever economic impact on Europe as a result of the sanctions, and there is no evidence that there's a greater crisis in Russia than in Europe right now. It's also important to note that Russia has already made it through two major crises in the 90s and in 2014 while Europe has not experienced anything similar in recent history. What remains to be seen is whether Europe or Russia will be able to handle the decoupling better.
Kbelicius 3y ago
> Plenty of recent articles clearly show that the sanctions have been an utter failure in practice. None of your links actually say that. What they do say is that sanctions did not have the short term impact that some hoped/predicted. What all of them say is that in the long term Russia is most likely fucked. Your claim that the sanctions have been an utter failure is divorced from logic if we go by the links that you provided.
- yogthos 3y ago
  IMF is literally projecting growth for Russia this year, but whatever you say buddy. Here is another article you might want to read carefully https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-the-economic-war-against-russia-has-failed/ https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-the-economic-war-aga...
  - Kbelicius 3y ago
    > IMF is literally projecting growth for Russia this year That doesn't translate to "sanctions are utter failure ". Again, your logic is failing you. > but whatever you say buddy The articles you linked to are saying that, have you read them? Reading comprehension is a valuable skill to have. > Here is another article you might want to read carefully > The country has suffered harm from western sanctions, even if nothing like on the scale that we imagined we could inflict. But if the West is thinking that in future it can fight wars purely by economic means, without bombs or bullets, it is badly mistaken. So even this new article that you linked disagrees that the sanctions were an utter failure...
    - yogthos 3y ago
      >That doesn't translate to "sanctions are utter failure ". Again, your logic is failing you. If you don't understand how Europe going into recession while Russia showing growth is a failure of the sanctions, then your logic if failing you I'm afraid. > The articles you linked to are saying that, have you read them? Reading comprehension is a valuable skill to have. And once you develop this skill then you'll be able to comprehend what these articles are saying. > So even this new article that you linked disagrees that the sanctions were an utter failure... Keep working on that reading comprehension.

The_Colonel 3y ago

It's kind of funny to hear Russians argue how sanctions utterly failed, they are hurting the West, do not hurt Russia, on the opposite only strengthen it ... There's a saying "never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake", yet it seems Russians do exactly that again and again?

yogthos 3y ago
This isn't the Russians arguing, this is mainstream western pres saying this.
- The_Colonel 3y ago
  Hand-picked to fit your agenda. No need to link the sources which disagree, right? Also, this link selection is provided by a Russian, so the point still stands.
  - yogthos 3y ago
    The only person with an agenda here is the one who keep using ad hominem attacks instead of providing any actual arguments. The reality is that the economic war has gone on for nearly two years now, and so far there is no sign of Russian economy collapsing. The sources I've provided come from mainstream western publications which are openly hostile to Russia, and they explain in black and white why the economic war has failed. I guess some people just aren't capable of engaging with reality.
    - The_Colonel 3y ago
      A person without an agenda would surely link also links which provide a different POV: * https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/12/01/ukraine-russia-sanctions-economy-war-putin-embargo-technology-financial-energy/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/12/01/ukraine-russia-sanction... * https://www.intereconomics.eu/contents/year/2023/number/1/article/why-sanctions-against-russia-work.html https://www.intereconomics.eu/contents/year/2023/number/1/ar... * https://www.csis.org/analysis/russia-sanctions-one-year https://www.csis.org/analysis/russia-sanctions-one-year Nobody claims the sanctions are perfect. Sometimes there are holes which need to be plugged. There are some other areas which should be sanctioned. The West should of course work on making the sanctions harder hitting.
      - yogthos 3y ago
        It's pretty weird to claim that providing articles with the information that supports the points I'm making is an agenda. The problem with the claims in the articles you linked make is that they're at odds with the reality we're currently observing. There has been no evidence that Russia's war in Ukraine has been negatively impacted by the sanctions, and the predictions we hear every month that Russia is going to run out of weapons are not coming true either. Meanwhile, economy in Russia appears to be doing just fine because the void that western companies left is being filled by companies from China and India. The whole premise of your argument seems to be based on the notion that countries can't have an economy that's independent from the west. This is an absurd idea given that the west accounts for only 20% of world's population. Majority of the world sharply disagrees with the west as studies commissioned by EU and US clearly show: https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-rest-global-public-opinion-one-year-into-russias-war-on-ukraine/ https://ecfr.eu/publication/united-west-divided-from-the-res... https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the-ukraine-war-viewed-from-the-global-south/ https://usrussiaaccord.org/acura-viewpoint-krishen-mehta-the... And here's how NYT puts it: > A year on, it’s becoming clearer: While the West’s core coalition remains remarkably solid, it never convinced the rest of the world to isolate Russia. https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/02/23/world/russia-ukraine-geopolitics.html https://archive.is/2023.02.23-211202/https://www.nytimes.com... What ultimately matters is the relative damage the sanctions are causing to Russia and Europe. There is clear evidence that there has been sever economic impact on Europe as a result of the sanctions, and there is no evidence that there's a greater crisis in Russia than in Europe right now. It's also important to note that Russia has already made it through two major crises in the 90s and in 2014 while Europe has not experienced anything similar in recent history. What remains to be seen is whether Europe or Russia will be able to handle the decoupling better.

Kbelicius 3y ago

> Plenty of recent articles clearly show that the sanctions have been an utter failure in practice. None of your links actually say that. What they do say is that sanctions did not have the short term impact that some hoped/predicted. What all of them say is that in the long term Russia is most likely fucked. Your claim that the sanctions have been an utter failure is divorced from logic if we go by the links that you provided.

yogthos 3y ago
IMF is literally projecting growth for Russia this year, but whatever you say buddy. Here is another article you might want to read carefully https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-the-economic-war-against-russia-has-failed/ https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-the-economic-war-aga...
- Kbelicius 3y ago
  > IMF is literally projecting growth for Russia this year That doesn't translate to "sanctions are utter failure ". Again, your logic is failing you. > but whatever you say buddy The articles you linked to are saying that, have you read them? Reading comprehension is a valuable skill to have. > Here is another article you might want to read carefully > The country has suffered harm from western sanctions, even if nothing like on the scale that we imagined we could inflict. But if the West is thinking that in future it can fight wars purely by economic means, without bombs or bullets, it is badly mistaken. So even this new article that you linked disagrees that the sanctions were an utter failure...
  - yogthos 3y ago
    >That doesn't translate to "sanctions are utter failure ". Again, your logic is failing you. If you don't understand how Europe going into recession while Russia showing growth is a failure of the sanctions, then your logic if failing you I'm afraid. > The articles you linked to are saying that, have you read them? Reading comprehension is a valuable skill to have. And once you develop this skill then you'll be able to comprehend what these articles are saying. > So even this new article that you linked disagrees that the sanctions were an utter failure... Keep working on that reading comprehension.