4 ms·

> Where would the biproducts (dirt) go? On the website, they suggest that these byproducts, i.e. waste, could effectively be dumped into space, where the solar

> Where would the biproducts (dirt) go? On the website, they suggest that these byproducts, i.e. waste, could effectively be dumped into space, where the solar winds would carry it out to the asteroid belt. I have no expertise to determine if this would ever be viable, but seems like they do at least answer this particular question of yours.

cjbgkagh 3y ago
I guess that could work, I did not think of that. Not sure if it greatly improves viability but venting into the solar winds I guess could be an option. At low earth orbit wouldn’t most material fall back down to Earth, it’s not like they’d be vending hydrogen. And a very high Earth orbit would incur even greater costs of getting material into space. It still seems bananas. Edit: I checked and solar wind starts at 60K km so there is no solar wind at LEO and 60K km is way beyond geostationary where it is already considered too expensive to bring things back to Earth.
- nickelcitymario 3y ago
  I had the same questions! But again, this is where my knowledge fails me. For example, if you release C02, how far away from earth would you need to be for it to not get caught in Earth's gravity? Still, it's a fascinating idea.
  - wongarsu 3y ago
    Anything within Earth's sphere of influence [1] (about 90000 km) will initially be in orbit around Earth. Unless you give it a kick that puts the highest point of the orbit further away from earth than that. Unless you shoot stuff away with railguns, the relevant question might be "at which point are solar winds a bigger factor than drag". I guess it's highly dependent on the exact gas. We lose Helium that way from earth (buoyancy brings it up, where solar winds catch it), so at some height it should work for CO2. It only really works for gases though, and then only for things that stay reasonably gaseous in orbit (low pressure and large temperature swings). For any solid or liquid you have to worry about it crashing into you on one of the orbits, and at orbital speeds tiny things can impact with a lot of energy. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_of_influence_(astrodynamics) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_of_influence_(astrodyna...
  - cjbgkagh 3y ago
    The more I look into it the less feasible it looks. My initial assumption is reflective of the peer comment that anything remotely heavy won’t have enough solar wind drag to get it out of Earths gravity well. Just to be in the solar wind alone you’d have to be outside the magnetosheath ~60K Km at its closest point, 35K Km is geostationary orbit which costs $10K kg to get to with falcon 9. And now you’d have to send up a whole falcon 9 in order to bring the non byproduct mass back to Earth which would defeat the purpose of venting CO2 to begin with. For those who don’t know it takes roughly the same delta V to bring things back down as it took to send them up.
  - DoreenMichele 3y ago
    I don't know the answer to that. Though I'm wondering: If manufacturing were done on the moon, would it be safe and feasible to haul some wastes to the lunar equator during the cold of night and let it burn up when daytime temps naturally exceed the boiling point of water from solar power alone?
- wombatpm 3y ago
  The better bet is to process raw materials in space and send refined products down to earth. Would you rather have strip-mining and smelting occurring in space or on earth? Daniel Suarez had a lot of fascinating ideas in Delta-V
  - Chris2048 3y ago
    > Would you rather have strip-mining and smelting occurring in space or on earth? I assume you mean "on the moon or on earth" since you can't really mine in empty space. The process of either (without air, for a start) would make them so different as to be incomparable. Mining on the moon would have so many expenses associated, that you could spend the same amount making earth-based processes cleaner. The issue is that it's economical not to do so, so earth processes are dirty by design and due to lack of regulation.
    - ajdude 3y ago
      I wonder how hard it would be to mine an asteroid, and then send the refined materials back to Earth from the asteroid belt. Sure, the initial trip would take a while, but after the initial package you could just keep shipping them every few weeks for a consistent supply.
- midoridensha 3y ago
  It's not bananas. What's bananas is the idea of getting all your raw materials from mines on the Earth, launching those to space factories, then sending the finished products back to Earth. Obviously, the goal is to do the mining in space (moon, asteroids, etc.), and then use those raw materials in space factories.
pugworthy 3y ago
I wonder what the impact would be on astronomy, whether space based or terrestrial?
deleted 3y ago
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cjbgkagh 3y ago

I guess that could work, I did not think of that. Not sure if it greatly improves viability but venting into the solar winds I guess could be an option. At low earth orbit wouldn’t most material fall back down to Earth, it’s not like they’d be vending hydrogen. And a very high Earth orbit would incur even greater costs of getting material into space. It still seems bananas. Edit: I checked and solar wind starts at 60K km so there is no solar wind at LEO and 60K km is way beyond geostationary where it is already considered too expensive to bring things back to Earth.

nickelcitymario 3y ago
I had the same questions! But again, this is where my knowledge fails me. For example, if you release C02, how far away from earth would you need to be for it to not get caught in Earth's gravity? Still, it's a fascinating idea.
- wongarsu 3y ago
  Anything within Earth's sphere of influence [1] (about 90000 km) will initially be in orbit around Earth. Unless you give it a kick that puts the highest point of the orbit further away from earth than that. Unless you shoot stuff away with railguns, the relevant question might be "at which point are solar winds a bigger factor than drag". I guess it's highly dependent on the exact gas. We lose Helium that way from earth (buoyancy brings it up, where solar winds catch it), so at some height it should work for CO2. It only really works for gases though, and then only for things that stay reasonably gaseous in orbit (low pressure and large temperature swings). For any solid or liquid you have to worry about it crashing into you on one of the orbits, and at orbital speeds tiny things can impact with a lot of energy. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_of_influence_(astrodynamics) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_of_influence_(astrodyna...
- cjbgkagh 3y ago
  The more I look into it the less feasible it looks. My initial assumption is reflective of the peer comment that anything remotely heavy won’t have enough solar wind drag to get it out of Earths gravity well. Just to be in the solar wind alone you’d have to be outside the magnetosheath ~60K Km at its closest point, 35K Km is geostationary orbit which costs $10K kg to get to with falcon 9. And now you’d have to send up a whole falcon 9 in order to bring the non byproduct mass back to Earth which would defeat the purpose of venting CO2 to begin with. For those who don’t know it takes roughly the same delta V to bring things back down as it took to send them up.
- DoreenMichele 3y ago
  I don't know the answer to that. Though I'm wondering: If manufacturing were done on the moon, would it be safe and feasible to haul some wastes to the lunar equator during the cold of night and let it burn up when daytime temps naturally exceed the boiling point of water from solar power alone?
wombatpm 3y ago
The better bet is to process raw materials in space and send refined products down to earth. Would you rather have strip-mining and smelting occurring in space or on earth? Daniel Suarez had a lot of fascinating ideas in Delta-V
- Chris2048 3y ago
  > Would you rather have strip-mining and smelting occurring in space or on earth? I assume you mean "on the moon or on earth" since you can't really mine in empty space. The process of either (without air, for a start) would make them so different as to be incomparable. Mining on the moon would have so many expenses associated, that you could spend the same amount making earth-based processes cleaner. The issue is that it's economical not to do so, so earth processes are dirty by design and due to lack of regulation.
  - ajdude 3y ago
    I wonder how hard it would be to mine an asteroid, and then send the refined materials back to Earth from the asteroid belt. Sure, the initial trip would take a while, but after the initial package you could just keep shipping them every few weeks for a consistent supply.
midoridensha 3y ago
It's not bananas. What's bananas is the idea of getting all your raw materials from mines on the Earth, launching those to space factories, then sending the finished products back to Earth. Obviously, the goal is to do the mining in space (moon, asteroids, etc.), and then use those raw materials in space factories.

pugworthy 3y ago

I wonder what the impact would be on astronomy, whether space based or terrestrial?

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]