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Speaking of this, has anyone tried Neuro-Linguistic Programming (eg the swish pattern) to accomplish the same goal? There are some interesting videos on Youtub

by itmag 15y ago

Speaking of this, has anyone tried Neuro-Linguistic Programming (eg the swish pattern) to accomplish the same goal? There are some interesting videos on Youtube of people having their phobias cured, for instance.

peteretep 15y ago
Having worked with a whole bunch of NLPers, the striking and consistent theme is how little success people practicing NLP actually seem to bring in to their lives. I've even been to one or two live NLP seminars, and the people you meet there really are the dregs of polite society. Everyone is looking for a quick fix, and yet most people have been taking the NLP kool-aid for three or four years, and excitedly talk about all the conferences they've been to...
- itmag 15y ago
  This guy is an acquaintance of mine: http://www.thebookbag.co.uk/reviews/index.php?title=Going_Mental:_Reaching_Your_Goals_in_Business_and_Sports_-_Full_Contact_NLP_Coaching_from_a_Full_Contact_Fighter_by_Jakob_Lovstad http://www.thebookbag.co.uk/reviews/index.php?title=Going_Me... He seems pretty successful at life (MMA fighter, author, software engineering degree, Oxford distinction holder). However, I don't know how much of that can be attributed to NLP. But just giving you one datapoint in the other direction.
  - peteretep 15y ago
    I knew a tall, good-looking, confident, and succesful guy, who claimed that his success with women came down to him hypnotising them. But I also knew a whole bunch of seriously weird guys whose lack of success with women was a probably a direct result of their thinking it was posible to hypnotise women in to bed...
    - itmag 15y ago
      So you've been in touch with the Speed Seduction community? Mind telling me more?, I'm fascinated by that stuff. Full disclosure: Ross Jeffries wrote an article for my magazine, so I may be slightly biased in favor.
      - peteretep 15y ago
        I worked as a dating coach fulltime for ~ 4 years, and all that stuff seemed pretty unsavoury. The idea that you could memorize a few lines and trick some woman back to your house by manipulating her spoke strongly to the worst kind of thought processes in people, in an industry otherwise notable for its commitment to personal growth.
        itmag 15y ago
        I worked as a dating coach fulltime for ~ 4 years, Whoa, now you've really got my interest. Tell me more, dude :)
JumpCrisscross 15y ago
Looks like rubbish: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuro-linguistic_programming#Empirical_validity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuro-linguistic_programming#Em... Whenever something's proponent is arguing for suspending the scientific method in preference for something that's "free from hypotheses, pre-conceptions and assumptions, and seeks to describe rather than explain" you know you're in trouble.
- itmag 15y ago
  I'm curious about a lot of things. Scientific backing is not a requirement for me to try something (as long as it's safe to try, of course). Of course, me trying something out also constitutes a form of science (with a sample size of n=1 and no placebo controls, but at least I find out if it works for me). That being said, I haven't given NLP a serious try (yet). I have a bunch of books on it but I find it hard to get started for some reason. Maybe I need a coach, but their rates are typically way out of my league. Here's an example of a book I own, which is NLP-based: http://www.amazon.com/Make-People-Like-Seconds-Less/dp/0761149465/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top http://www.amazon.com/Make-People-Like-Seconds-Less/dp/07611... The premise of that book is pretty damn appealing. Perhaps you see now why I'm interested in this area. My overall impression of NLPers is sleaziness and trying to milk me for money via their uber-expensive seminars. However, I'm still going to try and find out if the techniques are useful to me, since I do know people in my social circle for whom they seem to work. The main thing I like about NLP is how it breaks down thought. It doesn't just see "thoughts" as atomic, but rather asks about mental images, internal dialogue, emotional associations, etc (ie the VAKOG model of sensory representation - Visual Auditory Kinesthetic Olphactory Gustatory). All in all, I don't think I need to be karma-bitchslappad just for asking a question. Also, I'm already in a shitty mood since I'm still hungover from Saturday :)
- einhverfr 15y ago
  My views on NLP. I have known a lot of folks into it who had very little success in their lives and others who had a great deal of success. I think the problem for those who don't have success is that they are looking for a recipe book, while very often times what you have to do is find flexible patterns you can make work for you. Of course this also means that one cannot just follow the techniques as they are. It's an artistic, creative endeavor.

by itmag 15y ago

peteretep 15y ago

Having worked with a whole bunch of NLPers, the striking and consistent theme is how little success people practicing NLP actually seem to bring in to their lives. I've even been to one or two live NLP seminars, and the people you meet there really are the dregs of polite society. Everyone is looking for a quick fix, and yet most people have been taking the NLP kool-aid for three or four years, and excitedly talk about all the conferences they've been to...

itmag 15y ago
This guy is an acquaintance of mine: http://www.thebookbag.co.uk/reviews/index.php?title=Going_Mental:_Reaching_Your_Goals_in_Business_and_Sports_-_Full_Contact_NLP_Coaching_from_a_Full_Contact_Fighter_by_Jakob_Lovstad http://www.thebookbag.co.uk/reviews/index.php?title=Going_Me... He seems pretty successful at life (MMA fighter, author, software engineering degree, Oxford distinction holder). However, I don't know how much of that can be attributed to NLP. But just giving you one datapoint in the other direction.
- peteretep 15y ago
  I knew a tall, good-looking, confident, and succesful guy, who claimed that his success with women came down to him hypnotising them. But I also knew a whole bunch of seriously weird guys whose lack of success with women was a probably a direct result of their thinking it was posible to hypnotise women in to bed...
  - itmag 15y ago
    So you've been in touch with the Speed Seduction community? Mind telling me more?, I'm fascinated by that stuff. Full disclosure: Ross Jeffries wrote an article for my magazine, so I may be slightly biased in favor.
    - peteretep 15y ago
      I worked as a dating coach fulltime for ~ 4 years, and all that stuff seemed pretty unsavoury. The idea that you could memorize a few lines and trick some woman back to your house by manipulating her spoke strongly to the worst kind of thought processes in people, in an industry otherwise notable for its commitment to personal growth.
      - itmag 15y ago
        I worked as a dating coach fulltime for ~ 4 years, Whoa, now you've really got my interest. Tell me more, dude :)

JumpCrisscross 15y ago

Looks like rubbish: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuro-linguistic_programming#Empirical_validity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuro-linguistic_programming#Em... Whenever something's proponent is arguing for suspending the scientific method in preference for something that's "free from hypotheses, pre-conceptions and assumptions, and seeks to describe rather than explain" you know you're in trouble.

itmag 15y ago
I'm curious about a lot of things. Scientific backing is not a requirement for me to try something (as long as it's safe to try, of course). Of course, me trying something out also constitutes a form of science (with a sample size of n=1 and no placebo controls, but at least I find out if it works for me). That being said, I haven't given NLP a serious try (yet). I have a bunch of books on it but I find it hard to get started for some reason. Maybe I need a coach, but their rates are typically way out of my league. Here's an example of a book I own, which is NLP-based: http://www.amazon.com/Make-People-Like-Seconds-Less/dp/0761149465/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top http://www.amazon.com/Make-People-Like-Seconds-Less/dp/07611... The premise of that book is pretty damn appealing. Perhaps you see now why I'm interested in this area. My overall impression of NLPers is sleaziness and trying to milk me for money via their uber-expensive seminars. However, I'm still going to try and find out if the techniques are useful to me, since I do know people in my social circle for whom they seem to work. The main thing I like about NLP is how it breaks down thought. It doesn't just see "thoughts" as atomic, but rather asks about mental images, internal dialogue, emotional associations, etc (ie the VAKOG model of sensory representation - Visual Auditory Kinesthetic Olphactory Gustatory). All in all, I don't think I need to be karma-bitchslappad just for asking a question. Also, I'm already in a shitty mood since I'm still hungover from Saturday :)
einhverfr 15y ago
My views on NLP. I have known a lot of folks into it who had very little success in their lives and others who had a great deal of success. I think the problem for those who don't have success is that they are looking for a recipe book, while very often times what you have to do is find flexible patterns you can make work for you. Of course this also means that one cannot just follow the techniques as they are. It's an artistic, creative endeavor.