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What's with India and the shift towards the right? I thought it had too many religions and different cultures to pull this off.

dagmx 3y ago
India’s promise of secularism has always been fragile. The current party, the BJP, has strong roots in Hindu nationalism. It’s basically taken over a decade but they’ve successfully distorted the promise enshrined in our national anthem of an India for all.
candiddevmike 3y ago
I think it's similar to the US. There's some kind of global push towards a flavor of fascism occurring in most democratic countries. https://fpif.org/fascisms-global-spread-is-real-as-real-as-the-spread-of-covid-19/ https://fpif.org/fascisms-global-spread-is-real-as-real-as-t...
pjc50 3y ago
Ever since Partition (and indeed before) the Hindu vs Muslim conflict has been a powerful driver of both local violence and national politics.
throwaway384629 3y ago
BJP in India does not fight elections based on any development agendas like education/healthcare or social security. They pretends to the majority Hindu public that "Hindus are in danger from Muslims" and only BJP can protect them. They also project themselves as true nationalists and anyone having anti-government views is declared a "Pakistani" or anti-national. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/4/7/spike-in-anti-muslim-rallies-since-bjp-retook-indias-maharashtra https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/4/7/spike-in-anti-muslim...
- throwaway2305ax 3y ago
  Ok, this is not entirely true. - India is the fastest growing large economy in the world - inflation is under control - The infrastructure spend is the largest ever. There's construction everywhere. - life expectancy is significantly up Of course there are issues, but it's a mixed bag. Not all religion.
  - throwaway384629 3y ago
    >> India is the fastest growing large economy in the world Source please? >> inflation is under control Cooking Gas cylinder price: [1] June 2017: 552.50 May 2023: 1103.00 Petrol price (Even when India is importing dirt cheap crude oil from Russia): [2] Dec 2015: 60.00/litre May 2023: 100.00/litre >> - The infrastructure spend is the largest ever. There's construction everywhere. If certain companies and politically linked builders are building then that does not mean country is progressing. [1] https://www.bankbazaar.com/gas-connection/lpg-price-delhi.html https://www.bankbazaar.com/gas-connection/lpg-price-delhi.ht... [2] https://www.mypetrolprice.com/petrol-price-chart.aspx https://www.mypetrolprice.com/petrol-price-chart.aspx
    - testHNac 3y ago
      >> India is the fastest growing large economy in the world >Source please? For a journalist you seem to be incapable of finding basic information. Also, you are too misinformed to be a journalist. Are you sure you are not some frustrated kid grounded by his parents ? https://www.hindustantimes.com/business/at-6-1-india-to-be-fastest-growing-economy-projects-imf-china-at-52-101675132013366.html https://www.hindustantimes.com/business/at-6-1-india-to-be-f... https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2023/04/04/indian-economy-continues-to-show-resilience-amid-global-uncertainties https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2023/04/04/i... >>If certain companies and politically linked builders are building then that does not mean country is progressing. You nincompoop they are generating employment, building infrastructure and it is for growth of the country. If you have money create a business and give jobs instead of sh!tt!ng on HN with your AAM AADMI Party wh0ring.
- dartharva 3y ago
  Which political party in India primarily fights elections "based on any development agendas like education/healthcare or social security"? If there was one, how much "development" has that party achieved when in power?
  - throwaway384629 3y ago
    Aam Aadmi Party is one such party. Here is their 70 points action plan that they promised in 2015: https://aamaadmiparty.org/delhi-government-2/aap-manifesto-2015/ https://aamaadmiparty.org/delhi-government-2/aap-manifesto-2... And here is the public status check of each promise: https://www.indiatoday.in/diu/story/aap-s-5-year-report-card-did-kejriwal-s-govt-fulfill-its-promises-1644302-2020-02-07 https://www.indiatoday.in/diu/story/aap-s-5-year-report-card... Despite giving free electricity up to 200 Units/month, free water up to 20KL/month, free bus travel for women, the state budget is still surplus. The 2 leaders who made it possible are currently put in Jail by Modi Government. [1] [1] https://www.outlookindia.com/national/sisodia-jain-arrested-to-sabotage-good-work-being-done-in-delhi-alleges-kejriwal-news-266540 https://www.outlookindia.com/national/sisodia-jain-arrested-...
- Superblazer 3y ago
  As terrible as the government is, i want the foreigners here to understand that op also has his own agenda, this above reply shows their intentions. All indian political parties are low quality trash in their own ways.
  - throwaway384629 3y ago
    I am playing a role that any well functioning journalist should play. Question the government and point out any wrong doings. Isn't is a core aspect of democracy? Do you see anything wrong in that? >> All indian political parties are low quality trash in their own ways. Agree. But the one having power currently is the focus. Be it any party.
    - testHNac 3y ago
      You are not a journalist, you are a hack. You are not presenting a balanced opinion. You are biased and presenting a distorted view which you know is an easy sell here. From your posts you seem like a Typical Indian Redditor / Twitter activist. Who believes they have great potential in life, have nothing to show for it. So come here to sh!t on your country to get validation of Western people. Few HN karma points to make yourself feel like you have some value in this world. The typical Slave Mentality liberal that exists in India and Pakistan. A sad gift of the colonialism. You should work for Al jazeera, BBC, NYT etc They like to keep pets like you to parrot their talking points.
- testHNac 3y ago
  India has developed under the current Govt. When the entire Left bootlickers like Al Jazeera, CNN, NYT were criticizing the Indian Govt in 2020 onwards - They laid the foundation for growth. When your America is going broke and again increasing it's Debt Ceiling to pay for the survival of the populace, India is the fastest growing Economy in the world. A Billion Indians can decide who to vote for. Don't need some entitles White guys and their brown lackeys in BBC, Al Jazeera to come and tell us how to lead their lives. If your White Intellectuals had any capability your entire Western Economies wouldn't be in doldrums. The wisest thing Western Economists are capable of is increasing the Debt Ceiling repeatedly and printing money. Then bribe the dumb populace with welfare to vote for the same govt again.
- testHNac 3y ago
  BTW Democrat Party does fear mongering among Blacks and LGBT minorities and keeps them in perpetual fear and anxiety. They use this strategy to stay in power. And that's supposed to be approved by the Very Ethical Western Media and White Intellectuals. What hypocrites you lot are. Next year the Trump fear mongering will start again. And the Liberal Sheep on HN will get their panties in a bunch crying about how unsafe they are while earning a few 100k $ per year.
SturgeonsLaw 3y ago
Religion is a force that pulls people in a conservative direction, particularly when there has been a history of inter-religion conflict like in India
tdehnel 3y ago
Why would diversity necessarily be associated with leftism?
- Drakim 3y ago
  There is no "necessarily" about it, but it's obviously how history ended up unfolding. The big cultural-media-pop conflict in the west this very moment is centered around acceptance of diversity regarding gay and trans folks.
- pjc50 3y ago
  People are bad with labels; diversity is associated with liberalism, which often gets conflated with a whole spectrum of other positions from social-democrat to actual Marxists (who tend not to be all that pro-diversity, depending on how "tankie" they are)
eunos 3y ago
these days lots of Indian twitter accounts that shown on my feed are itching for Hindutva. P.S Not an Indian so Idk how they appeared on my feed.
- Utkarsh_Mood 3y ago
  Here's the definition of Hindutva according to the Supreme Court, if anyone's curious “Hindutva is understood as a way of life of state of mind and is not to be equated with or understood as religious Hindu fundamentalism…it is a fallacy and error of law to proceed on the assumption…that the use of words Hindutva or Hinduism per se depicts an attitude hostile to all persons practicing any religion other than the Hindu religion.”
  - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
    > the definition of Hindutva according to the Supreme Court Legal definitions aren’t relevant to Twitter accounts. What matters is what’s animating the author.
    - Utkarsh_Mood 3y ago
      All the same, imo it's imperative people know what the actual definition is rather than misconstruing it for something else
      - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
        > it's imperative people know what the actual definition This reminds me of the hacker/cracker and crypto qua -currency/-tography debates. Or, more pointedly, the Daughters of the Confederacy. Legal definitions aren’t “actual definitions.” Nobody likes a term they’ve adopted to be coöpted. But it happens, and it’s happened with hindutva in English.
renewiltord 3y ago
It has lots of religions and cultures, yeah. But there is a dominant one. And like the US is a Christian nation de-facto, India is a Hindu nation de-facto. The bigger driving thing is that the party in power has two massive things in their favour: widespread economic growth and prosperity. While India mostly runs through coalition politics, there are two broad bands: the nationalist religious-fundamentalist market-economics band and the high-regulation nominally-secular band. It's quite nuanced, but ultimately, India has raised 400 million out of poverty in the last 20 years, electrified vastly, and built rail and road infrastructure at a crucial moment in their demographic transition. The resulting goodwill is of the "it's about the economy, stupid" sense but also a national feeling that perhaps the "others" were, after all, "holding us back" because the current opposition presided over a period of administration over many decades where setting up businesses required paying off the right guy, etc. To make it worse, the opposition coalition head is a dynastic scion who is not very smart. So, the shift to the right is natural because the right is the only one giving them anything.
adrr 3y ago
World has moved towards authoritarian governments. Haven't seen a good reason why this push but there seems to be correlated to the amount information people have access to(eg: social networks, digital media etc).
- tacocataco 3y ago
  Wasn't there plenty of authoritarian governments before the internet?
JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> What's with India and the shift towards the right? Successful republics appear to waver between stable liberalism and dynamic authoritarianism. We were relatively authoritarian in the Pinkerton and New Deal eras. Modi is delivering on a proven enthnonationalism liberal-economic playbook. It’s hard to argue against fattening pocketbooks and rising living standards.
- throwaway384629 3y ago
  >> It’s hard to argue against fattening pocketbooks and rising living standards. You mean Adani's? [1] [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/billionaires/profiles/gautam-s-adani/ https://www.bloomberg.com/billionaires/profiles/gautam-s-ada...
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
vithlani 3y ago
[dead]

dagmx 3y ago

India’s promise of secularism has always been fragile. The current party, the BJP, has strong roots in Hindu nationalism. It’s basically taken over a decade but they’ve successfully distorted the promise enshrined in our national anthem of an India for all.

candiddevmike 3y ago

I think it's similar to the US. There's some kind of global push towards a flavor of fascism occurring in most democratic countries. https://fpif.org/fascisms-global-spread-is-real-as-real-as-the-spread-of-covid-19/ https://fpif.org/fascisms-global-spread-is-real-as-real-as-t...

pjc50 3y ago

Ever since Partition (and indeed before) the Hindu vs Muslim conflict has been a powerful driver of both local violence and national politics.

throwaway384629 3y ago

BJP in India does not fight elections based on any development agendas like education/healthcare or social security. They pretends to the majority Hindu public that "Hindus are in danger from Muslims" and only BJP can protect them. They also project themselves as true nationalists and anyone having anti-government views is declared a "Pakistani" or anti-national. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/4/7/spike-in-anti-muslim-rallies-since-bjp-retook-indias-maharashtra https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/4/7/spike-in-anti-muslim...

throwaway2305ax 3y ago
Ok, this is not entirely true. - India is the fastest growing large economy in the world - inflation is under control - The infrastructure spend is the largest ever. There's construction everywhere. - life expectancy is significantly up Of course there are issues, but it's a mixed bag. Not all religion.
- throwaway384629 3y ago
  >> India is the fastest growing large economy in the world Source please? >> inflation is under control Cooking Gas cylinder price: [1] June 2017: 552.50 May 2023: 1103.00 Petrol price (Even when India is importing dirt cheap crude oil from Russia): [2] Dec 2015: 60.00/litre May 2023: 100.00/litre >> - The infrastructure spend is the largest ever. There's construction everywhere. If certain companies and politically linked builders are building then that does not mean country is progressing. [1] https://www.bankbazaar.com/gas-connection/lpg-price-delhi.html https://www.bankbazaar.com/gas-connection/lpg-price-delhi.ht... [2] https://www.mypetrolprice.com/petrol-price-chart.aspx https://www.mypetrolprice.com/petrol-price-chart.aspx
  - testHNac 3y ago
    >> India is the fastest growing large economy in the world >Source please? For a journalist you seem to be incapable of finding basic information. Also, you are too misinformed to be a journalist. Are you sure you are not some frustrated kid grounded by his parents ? https://www.hindustantimes.com/business/at-6-1-india-to-be-fastest-growing-economy-projects-imf-china-at-52-101675132013366.html https://www.hindustantimes.com/business/at-6-1-india-to-be-f... https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2023/04/04/indian-economy-continues-to-show-resilience-amid-global-uncertainties https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2023/04/04/i... >>If certain companies and politically linked builders are building then that does not mean country is progressing. You nincompoop they are generating employment, building infrastructure and it is for growth of the country. If you have money create a business and give jobs instead of sh!tt!ng on HN with your AAM AADMI Party wh0ring.
dartharva 3y ago
Which political party in India primarily fights elections "based on any development agendas like education/healthcare or social security"? If there was one, how much "development" has that party achieved when in power?
- throwaway384629 3y ago
  Aam Aadmi Party is one such party. Here is their 70 points action plan that they promised in 2015: https://aamaadmiparty.org/delhi-government-2/aap-manifesto-2015/ https://aamaadmiparty.org/delhi-government-2/aap-manifesto-2... And here is the public status check of each promise: https://www.indiatoday.in/diu/story/aap-s-5-year-report-card-did-kejriwal-s-govt-fulfill-its-promises-1644302-2020-02-07 https://www.indiatoday.in/diu/story/aap-s-5-year-report-card... Despite giving free electricity up to 200 Units/month, free water up to 20KL/month, free bus travel for women, the state budget is still surplus. The 2 leaders who made it possible are currently put in Jail by Modi Government. [1] [1] https://www.outlookindia.com/national/sisodia-jain-arrested-to-sabotage-good-work-being-done-in-delhi-alleges-kejriwal-news-266540 https://www.outlookindia.com/national/sisodia-jain-arrested-...
Superblazer 3y ago
As terrible as the government is, i want the foreigners here to understand that op also has his own agenda, this above reply shows their intentions. All indian political parties are low quality trash in their own ways.
- throwaway384629 3y ago
  I am playing a role that any well functioning journalist should play. Question the government and point out any wrong doings. Isn't is a core aspect of democracy? Do you see anything wrong in that? >> All indian political parties are low quality trash in their own ways. Agree. But the one having power currently is the focus. Be it any party.
  - testHNac 3y ago
    You are not a journalist, you are a hack. You are not presenting a balanced opinion. You are biased and presenting a distorted view which you know is an easy sell here. From your posts you seem like a Typical Indian Redditor / Twitter activist. Who believes they have great potential in life, have nothing to show for it. So come here to sh!t on your country to get validation of Western people. Few HN karma points to make yourself feel like you have some value in this world. The typical Slave Mentality liberal that exists in India and Pakistan. A sad gift of the colonialism. You should work for Al jazeera, BBC, NYT etc They like to keep pets like you to parrot their talking points.
testHNac 3y ago
India has developed under the current Govt. When the entire Left bootlickers like Al Jazeera, CNN, NYT were criticizing the Indian Govt in 2020 onwards - They laid the foundation for growth. When your America is going broke and again increasing it's Debt Ceiling to pay for the survival of the populace, India is the fastest growing Economy in the world. A Billion Indians can decide who to vote for. Don't need some entitles White guys and their brown lackeys in BBC, Al Jazeera to come and tell us how to lead their lives. If your White Intellectuals had any capability your entire Western Economies wouldn't be in doldrums. The wisest thing Western Economists are capable of is increasing the Debt Ceiling repeatedly and printing money. Then bribe the dumb populace with welfare to vote for the same govt again.
testHNac 3y ago
BTW Democrat Party does fear mongering among Blacks and LGBT minorities and keeps them in perpetual fear and anxiety. They use this strategy to stay in power. And that's supposed to be approved by the Very Ethical Western Media and White Intellectuals. What hypocrites you lot are. Next year the Trump fear mongering will start again. And the Liberal Sheep on HN will get their panties in a bunch crying about how unsafe they are while earning a few 100k $ per year.

SturgeonsLaw 3y ago

Religion is a force that pulls people in a conservative direction, particularly when there has been a history of inter-religion conflict like in India

tdehnel 3y ago

Why would diversity necessarily be associated with leftism?

Drakim 3y ago
There is no "necessarily" about it, but it's obviously how history ended up unfolding. The big cultural-media-pop conflict in the west this very moment is centered around acceptance of diversity regarding gay and trans folks.
pjc50 3y ago
People are bad with labels; diversity is associated with liberalism, which often gets conflated with a whole spectrum of other positions from social-democrat to actual Marxists (who tend not to be all that pro-diversity, depending on how "tankie" they are)

eunos 3y ago

these days lots of Indian twitter accounts that shown on my feed are itching for Hindutva. P.S Not an Indian so Idk how they appeared on my feed.

Utkarsh_Mood 3y ago
Here's the definition of Hindutva according to the Supreme Court, if anyone's curious “Hindutva is understood as a way of life of state of mind and is not to be equated with or understood as religious Hindu fundamentalism…it is a fallacy and error of law to proceed on the assumption…that the use of words Hindutva or Hinduism per se depicts an attitude hostile to all persons practicing any religion other than the Hindu religion.”
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  > the definition of Hindutva according to the Supreme Court Legal definitions aren’t relevant to Twitter accounts. What matters is what’s animating the author.
  - Utkarsh_Mood 3y ago
    All the same, imo it's imperative people know what the actual definition is rather than misconstruing it for something else
    - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
      > it's imperative people know what the actual definition This reminds me of the hacker/cracker and crypto qua -currency/-tography debates. Or, more pointedly, the Daughters of the Confederacy. Legal definitions aren’t “actual definitions.” Nobody likes a term they’ve adopted to be coöpted. But it happens, and it’s happened with hindutva in English.

renewiltord 3y ago

It has lots of religions and cultures, yeah. But there is a dominant one. And like the US is a Christian nation de-facto, India is a Hindu nation de-facto. The bigger driving thing is that the party in power has two massive things in their favour: widespread economic growth and prosperity. While India mostly runs through coalition politics, there are two broad bands: the nationalist religious-fundamentalist market-economics band and the high-regulation nominally-secular band. It's quite nuanced, but ultimately, India has raised 400 million out of poverty in the last 20 years, electrified vastly, and built rail and road infrastructure at a crucial moment in their demographic transition. The resulting goodwill is of the "it's about the economy, stupid" sense but also a national feeling that perhaps the "others" were, after all, "holding us back" because the current opposition presided over a period of administration over many decades where setting up businesses required paying off the right guy, etc. To make it worse, the opposition coalition head is a dynastic scion who is not very smart. So, the shift to the right is natural because the right is the only one giving them anything.

adrr 3y ago

World has moved towards authoritarian governments. Haven't seen a good reason why this push but there seems to be correlated to the amount information people have access to(eg: social networks, digital media etc).

tacocataco 3y ago
Wasn't there plenty of authoritarian governments before the internet?

JumpCrisscross 3y ago

> What's with India and the shift towards the right? Successful republics appear to waver between stable liberalism and dynamic authoritarianism. We were relatively authoritarian in the Pinkerton and New Deal eras. Modi is delivering on a proven enthnonationalism liberal-economic playbook. It’s hard to argue against fattening pocketbooks and rising living standards.

throwaway384629 3y ago
>> It’s hard to argue against fattening pocketbooks and rising living standards. You mean Adani's? [1] [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/billionaires/profiles/gautam-s-adani/ https://www.bloomberg.com/billionaires/profiles/gautam-s-ada...

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

vithlani 3y ago

[dead]