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For the past year I exclusively use Lua for my side projects. And I use it with certain self-imposed restrictions: * no Luarocks * no native libraries More d

For the past year I exclusively use Lua for my side projects. And I use it with certain self-imposed restrictions: * no Luarocks * no native libraries More details: http://akkartik.name/freewheeling http://akkartik.name/freewheeling

iamcreasy 3y ago
Can you kindly provide a one line explanation as to why no Luarocks?
- akkartik 3y ago
  https://xkcd.com/2347 https://xkcd.com/2347 That way lies npm and left-pad. Tools encourage behaviors. I avoid tools that encourage behaviors I want to avoid.
- AHTERIX5000 3y ago
  Luarocks works quite well if the lib is pure Lua. For native libs it's a wild west and success depends a lot on your environment. Sometimes the lib is being built with -Werror and fails if you're using more recent compiler, sometimes include paths are not resolved correctly using pkgconfig or similar and so on.
harryvederci 3y ago
Great talk!
carapace 3y ago
That essay/software/discipline is awesome!
nmz 3y ago
Problem is, which version of love to use? I do know someone had a multiversion love program but it didn't work for me.
- akkartik 3y ago
  Could you point me at it? Just for my own understanding.
  - nmz 3y ago
    I think its this but I am unsure. https://github.com/Alloyed/flirt https://github.com/Alloyed/flirt
    - akkartik 3y ago
      I just looked at this. It feels awfully brittle. My goal at the moment is to try to support every version of LÖVE going forward. All my apps work with any version after 11.0. Hopefully that streak won't be too onerous to continue in the future. Here's how my apps' version check works, based on suggestions from the LÖVE Discord (but mistakes are mine): https://git.sr.ht/~akkartik/template-live/tree/9cddb20b96aa1beaeee4c5d8aa9f5ac67a859724/item/main.lua#L45 https://git.sr.ht/~akkartik/template-live/tree/9cddb20b96aa1... I don't use t.version in conf.lua anymore in Freewheeling Apps (though my early apps are not perfect)
      - nmz 3y ago
        I've never used love. It's certainly difficult if you're going with portability, and then add to that backwards compatibility. I've talked about this before, but I think the only way to do versioning is the way everyone does it nowadays. Have a directory, with a wrapper around the dvcs/(Commits/ Tags/) and then a subdirectory for a "git workingset", And then you Import("url",{tag="",commit="",req="x.y.z"}), it should be fast because you're just doing io.open($REPOHOME/$URL/TAG/$TAG/$COMMIT/x/y/z) which just gets dropped to require() as normal. of course, add LÖVE to the mix and I just don't know. love should have mandatorily a love-VERSION as the command.
onehair 3y ago
how has your experience without using types in lua been so far with regards to finding out where issues reside and debugging unexpected values?
- akkartik 3y ago
  Great question! It's not ideal, but has been outweighed so far by the other benefits I mentioned. I do track the issues I run into due to lack of static types[1] in the Manual_tests files in each of my projects, e.g. https://github.com/akkartik/lines.love/blob/e568378ecb/Manual_tests.md#other-compromises https://github.com/akkartik/lines.love/blob/e568378ecb/Manua... [1] I wouldn't say Lua/Python/Javascript has no types. They just lack types for variables rather than values. Forth, on the other hand, has no types period.

iamcreasy 3y ago

Can you kindly provide a one line explanation as to why no Luarocks?

akkartik 3y ago
https://xkcd.com/2347 https://xkcd.com/2347 That way lies npm and left-pad. Tools encourage behaviors. I avoid tools that encourage behaviors I want to avoid.
AHTERIX5000 3y ago
Luarocks works quite well if the lib is pure Lua. For native libs it's a wild west and success depends a lot on your environment. Sometimes the lib is being built with -Werror and fails if you're using more recent compiler, sometimes include paths are not resolved correctly using pkgconfig or similar and so on.

harryvederci 3y ago

Great talk!

carapace 3y ago

That essay/software/discipline is awesome!

nmz 3y ago

Problem is, which version of love to use? I do know someone had a multiversion love program but it didn't work for me.

akkartik 3y ago
Could you point me at it? Just for my own understanding.
- nmz 3y ago
  I think its this but I am unsure. https://github.com/Alloyed/flirt https://github.com/Alloyed/flirt
  - akkartik 3y ago
    I just looked at this. It feels awfully brittle. My goal at the moment is to try to support every version of LÖVE going forward. All my apps work with any version after 11.0. Hopefully that streak won't be too onerous to continue in the future. Here's how my apps' version check works, based on suggestions from the LÖVE Discord (but mistakes are mine): https://git.sr.ht/~akkartik/template-live/tree/9cddb20b96aa1beaeee4c5d8aa9f5ac67a859724/item/main.lua#L45 https://git.sr.ht/~akkartik/template-live/tree/9cddb20b96aa1... I don't use t.version in conf.lua anymore in Freewheeling Apps (though my early apps are not perfect)
    - nmz 3y ago
      I've never used love. It's certainly difficult if you're going with portability, and then add to that backwards compatibility. I've talked about this before, but I think the only way to do versioning is the way everyone does it nowadays. Have a directory, with a wrapper around the dvcs/(Commits/ Tags/) and then a subdirectory for a "git workingset", And then you Import("url",{tag="",commit="",req="x.y.z"}), it should be fast because you're just doing io.open($REPOHOME/$URL/TAG/$TAG/$COMMIT/x/y/z) which just gets dropped to require() as normal. of course, add LÖVE to the mix and I just don't know. love should have mandatorily a love-VERSION as the command.

onehair 3y ago

how has your experience without using types in lua been so far with regards to finding out where issues reside and debugging unexpected values?

akkartik 3y ago
Great question! It's not ideal, but has been outweighed so far by the other benefits I mentioned. I do track the issues I run into due to lack of static types[1] in the Manual_tests files in each of my projects, e.g. https://github.com/akkartik/lines.love/blob/e568378ecb/Manual_tests.md#other-compromises https://github.com/akkartik/lines.love/blob/e568378ecb/Manua... [1] I wouldn't say Lua/Python/Javascript has no types. They just lack types for variables rather than values. Forth, on the other hand, has no types period.