3 ms·

People drink coffee and tea around the world. Where’s the line, really?

Gunnerhead 3y ago
Also coca and khat leaves in different parts of the world.
MobiusHorizons 3y ago
There is very likely no line that would apply uniformly between people or even the same person in different states of stress and health, regardless of the exact criteria you are optimizing for. Some people find even coffee to be too much at times. But at the end of the day amphetamines have some pretty scary and dangerous long term documented effects especially if the person goes without sleep for like periods of time. It’s not as bad as meth (to the best of my understanding) but both are amphetamines.
- danielheath 3y ago
  At least for me, ADHD stimulant meds taken in the morning don't impact sleep at all; if I have some more around midday, I need to take additional care with my bedtime routine to get my 8 hours (otherwise it takes too long to fall asleep). Prescription meds are not _anything_ like party drugs, either in dose or in isomer. Comparing them to meth is a reactionary talking point regularly brought up among those upset a previously-underdiagnosed illness is suddenly being treated.
- junofan 3y ago
  There’s a pretty big difference between smoking half a gram of meth and taking 5–10 mg of Adderall in tablet form every morning.
- idlewords 3y ago
  You need to do a little more research here, honestly. The scary side effects of heavy ampethamine use are mostly due to the associated sleep deprivation that it masks. If you work in an office setting or a school, then I guarantee you are surrounded by people who have spent years on a daily dose of these stimulants without any issues. The main problem with meth, which Adderall solves, is that the supply chain is some hobo in a trailer rather than nice, government-regulated pharmaceutical plants.
pierat 3y ago
"Drugs I use are fine, but I don't use are evil and horrible."
- morkalork 3y ago
  Eh, not even. To use the UK as an example (not that any other western country is better): >A report in Britain’s Sunday Times said a dozen sites inside the Palace of Westminster, which includes the House of Lords and House of Commons, tested positive for traces of cocaine.* * https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/12/06/british-parliament-cocaine-toilets/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/12/06/british-parl...
deleted 3y ago
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dmbche 3y ago
Ha - let's freely dispense amphetamines to all, it'll surely help the economy! Edit: We're talking about amphetamine based production being non sustainable - by comparing with tea and coffee I imagine you mean that we should expect people to take amphetamines to the same extant they take other stimulants (ie: to wake up, to work longer, to focus, etc). We shouldn't expect everyone to be on stimulants, we should lower the workload. This has been a problem for years in academia and in medecine - people taking amphetamines and cocaine to be able to compete in their field. Without talking about expectations in other fields - I've seen my fair share of cocaine and speed in kitchens and in service - I don't think it's sustainable. If you need speed, the workload is too much for one individual. Speed is not a long term solution.
striking 3y ago
When taken as directed I'd be inclined to agree, but there is definitely a non-negligible likelihood of individuals misusing it and forming a dependence as a result, more immediately so than caffeine.

Also coca and khat leaves in different parts of the world.

There is very likely no line that would apply uniformly between people or even the same person in different states of stress and health, regardless of the exact criteria you are optimizing for. Some people find even coffee to be too much at times. But at the end of the day amphetamines have some pretty scary and dangerous long term documented effects especially if the person goes without sleep for like periods of time. It’s not as bad as meth (to the best of my understanding) but both are amphetamines.

danielheath 3y ago
At least for me, ADHD stimulant meds taken in the morning don't impact sleep at all; if I have some more around midday, I need to take additional care with my bedtime routine to get my 8 hours (otherwise it takes too long to fall asleep). Prescription meds are not _anything_ like party drugs, either in dose or in isomer. Comparing them to meth is a reactionary talking point regularly brought up among those upset a previously-underdiagnosed illness is suddenly being treated.
junofan 3y ago
There’s a pretty big difference between smoking half a gram of meth and taking 5–10 mg of Adderall in tablet form every morning.
idlewords 3y ago
You need to do a little more research here, honestly. The scary side effects of heavy ampethamine use are mostly due to the associated sleep deprivation that it masks. If you work in an office setting or a school, then I guarantee you are surrounded by people who have spent years on a daily dose of these stimulants without any issues. The main problem with meth, which Adderall solves, is that the supply chain is some hobo in a trailer rather than nice, government-regulated pharmaceutical plants.

pierat 3y ago

"Drugs I use are fine, but I don't use are evil and horrible."

morkalork 3y ago
Eh, not even. To use the UK as an example (not that any other western country is better): >A report in Britain’s Sunday Times said a dozen sites inside the Palace of Westminster, which includes the House of Lords and House of Commons, tested positive for traces of cocaine.* * https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/12/06/british-parliament-cocaine-toilets/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/12/06/british-parl...

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

dmbche 3y ago

Ha - let's freely dispense amphetamines to all, it'll surely help the economy! Edit: We're talking about amphetamine based production being non sustainable - by comparing with tea and coffee I imagine you mean that we should expect people to take amphetamines to the same extant they take other stimulants (ie: to wake up, to work longer, to focus, etc). We shouldn't expect everyone to be on stimulants, we should lower the workload. This has been a problem for years in academia and in medecine - people taking amphetamines and cocaine to be able to compete in their field. Without talking about expectations in other fields - I've seen my fair share of cocaine and speed in kitchens and in service - I don't think it's sustainable. If you need speed, the workload is too much for one individual. Speed is not a long term solution.

striking 3y ago

When taken as directed I'd be inclined to agree, but there is definitely a non-negligible likelihood of individuals misusing it and forming a dependence as a result, more immediately so than caffeine.