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He’s been paying for the Starlink connection that the Ukrainian army has been using in the field. Tell me again how he’s anti-Ukrainian?

dragontamer 3y ago
1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/04/08/us-quietly-paying-millions-send-starlink-terminals-ukraine-contrary-spacexs-claims/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/04/08/us-quietl... Those come from the Pentagon's budget, not Elon Musk. 2. Musk turned off Starlink in Crimea. 3. Musk believes Crimea belongs to Russia. Following, and loudly proclaiming, Russian propaganda. ---------- Given all the issues Starlink has been having, all it has proven is that SpaceX is an unreliable partner. In the future, its clear that unless your politics line up with Musk, you shouldn't trust that internet service.
- remote_phone 3y ago
  That article was dated April 8th 2022 over a year ago. A more recent article says that the U.S. stopped paying for them in September and SpaceX picked up the costs. Then in December they got funding from European countries. If Musk were “anti-Ukraine” he would have simply stopped the service. SpaceX is the sole internet provider for a vast part of Ukraine. A Ukrainian official said: "Musk assured us he will continue to support Ukraine. When we had a powerful blackout, I messaged him on that day and he momentarily reacted and has already delivered some steps. He understands the situation." Boy, that doesn’t sound very anti-Ukrainian to me. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/12/starlink-will-send-another-10000-satellite-terminals-to-ukraine/amp/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/12/starlink-will-se... Crimea belongs to Russia. Russia invaded in 2014 and no one, including Obama, did anything about it. The entire world stepped back and let it happen. No one lifted a finger. You can’t go back and retroactively show your disapproval over something almost 10 years later and say “hey that shouldn’t have happened!”. The outcome of war determines who owns land, regardless of what people may want to see. People may say what they want about Israel’s right to occupy the Holy Land but I dare them to try to take it away through war. Israel owns the land that it occupies.
  - lisasays 3y ago
    You can’t go back and retroactively show your disapproval over something almost 10 years later and say “hey that shouldn’t have happened!”. Actually you can and it happens all the time. Crimea belongs to Russia. Just as your car now belongs to me, every since I saw you left the keys in it and decided to take it out for a joy ride.
  - dragontamer 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - remote_phone 3y ago
      I’m stating a fact with no opinion behind it. Russia owns Crimea. If the rest of the world cared or supported Ukraine back in 2014, they would have done something but no one lifted a finger including Obama. These are facts. If the world wants to help Ukraine reclaim Crimea then they would be doing so but no one is. Now whether the world SHOULD help Ukraine reclaim Crimea is a separate question but there is no confusion over the ownership of Crimea currently: it’s Russia. To argue otherwise is unintelligent and immature.
      - dragontamer 3y ago
        1. Ukraine wants starlink over Crimea. 2. Russia does not. Do you support #1 or #2? Mr. Musk has chosen #2, a decidedly pro-Russian stance on this matter. If you want to argue #2 or whatever, sure. Whatever. But that's on you buddy, and whatever semantic games you wanna play I don't have to put up with it. I recognize what you want. ---------- In any case, its obvious Mr. Musk isn't a reliable partner. We need to work on giving the Ukrainian commandos (and partisans) in Crimea access to internet without Starlink. Even if we somehow forced Mr. Musk into the right decision here, he could flip at any time. So finding an alternative satellite internet company is in USA's and Ukraine's best interest.
        remote_phone 3y ago
        What exactly is your point now, because you’re all over the place and thrashing in a cringeworthy fashion. You argued that Musk was “anti-Ukrainian” and I destroyed that argument with words from Ukrainian officials themselves. Now you’re saying… that Musk is still anti-Ukrainian because he turned off Starlink in Crimea even though he has it in every other place in Ukraine? Or that Musk is inconsistent or capricious? Go ahead but don’t expect me to participate and waste my time, I’m not interested.

dragontamer 3y ago

1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/04/08/us-quietly-paying-millions-send-starlink-terminals-ukraine-contrary-spacexs-claims/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/04/08/us-quietl... Those come from the Pentagon's budget, not Elon Musk. 2. Musk turned off Starlink in Crimea. 3. Musk believes Crimea belongs to Russia. Following, and loudly proclaiming, Russian propaganda. ---------- Given all the issues Starlink has been having, all it has proven is that SpaceX is an unreliable partner. In the future, its clear that unless your politics line up with Musk, you shouldn't trust that internet service.

remote_phone 3y ago
That article was dated April 8th 2022 over a year ago. A more recent article says that the U.S. stopped paying for them in September and SpaceX picked up the costs. Then in December they got funding from European countries. If Musk were “anti-Ukraine” he would have simply stopped the service. SpaceX is the sole internet provider for a vast part of Ukraine. A Ukrainian official said: "Musk assured us he will continue to support Ukraine. When we had a powerful blackout, I messaged him on that day and he momentarily reacted and has already delivered some steps. He understands the situation." Boy, that doesn’t sound very anti-Ukrainian to me. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/12/starlink-will-send-another-10000-satellite-terminals-to-ukraine/amp/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/12/starlink-will-se... Crimea belongs to Russia. Russia invaded in 2014 and no one, including Obama, did anything about it. The entire world stepped back and let it happen. No one lifted a finger. You can’t go back and retroactively show your disapproval over something almost 10 years later and say “hey that shouldn’t have happened!”. The outcome of war determines who owns land, regardless of what people may want to see. People may say what they want about Israel’s right to occupy the Holy Land but I dare them to try to take it away through war. Israel owns the land that it occupies.
- lisasays 3y ago
  You can’t go back and retroactively show your disapproval over something almost 10 years later and say “hey that shouldn’t have happened!”. Actually you can and it happens all the time. Crimea belongs to Russia. Just as your car now belongs to me, every since I saw you left the keys in it and decided to take it out for a joy ride.
- dragontamer 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - remote_phone 3y ago
    I’m stating a fact with no opinion behind it. Russia owns Crimea. If the rest of the world cared or supported Ukraine back in 2014, they would have done something but no one lifted a finger including Obama. These are facts. If the world wants to help Ukraine reclaim Crimea then they would be doing so but no one is. Now whether the world SHOULD help Ukraine reclaim Crimea is a separate question but there is no confusion over the ownership of Crimea currently: it’s Russia. To argue otherwise is unintelligent and immature.
    - dragontamer 3y ago
      1. Ukraine wants starlink over Crimea. 2. Russia does not. Do you support #1 or #2? Mr. Musk has chosen #2, a decidedly pro-Russian stance on this matter. If you want to argue #2 or whatever, sure. Whatever. But that's on you buddy, and whatever semantic games you wanna play I don't have to put up with it. I recognize what you want. ---------- In any case, its obvious Mr. Musk isn't a reliable partner. We need to work on giving the Ukrainian commandos (and partisans) in Crimea access to internet without Starlink. Even if we somehow forced Mr. Musk into the right decision here, he could flip at any time. So finding an alternative satellite internet company is in USA's and Ukraine's best interest.
      - remote_phone 3y ago
        What exactly is your point now, because you’re all over the place and thrashing in a cringeworthy fashion. You argued that Musk was “anti-Ukrainian” and I destroyed that argument with words from Ukrainian officials themselves. Now you’re saying… that Musk is still anti-Ukrainian because he turned off Starlink in Crimea even though he has it in every other place in Ukraine? Or that Musk is inconsistent or capricious? Go ahead but don’t expect me to participate and waste my time, I’m not interested.