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It's very strange to see the sentence "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" coming from the Chief Justice. I don't like seeing a person and an entity like the g
by grensley 3y ago
It's very strange to see the sentence "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" coming from the Chief Justice. I don't like seeing a person and an entity like the government used interchangeably like that. Leaves that Citizens United bad taste in my mouth.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- dehrmann 3y agoYou should read "Caesar" as "Uncle Sam." It's just that the quote is "render unto Caesar..." Like sibling said, the church and state bit is more interesting.
- grensley 3y agoEven that is weird. Anthropomorphizing the government.
- Retric 3y agoThe freaky bit is it’s a biblical quote though he left off the god bit at the end of it.
- baggy_trough 3y agoWhy would that be “freaky”? The Bible is one of the most important and highly recognized works in Western culture.
- Retric 3y agoBoth article 6 and the first amendment make it in very poor taste. You may personally appreciate it, but suppose he had been quoting different religions texts. Say the need to nourish Mayan gods using sacrificial blood.
- usefulcat 3y agoSuch a reference might easily have been lost on his audience, in which case he would sound nonsensical at best and foolish at worst?
- Retric 3y agoI suspect most Americans hearing the quote he used didn’t understand it.
- dehrmann 3y agoYou should read Kennedy v. Bremerton School District.
- Retric 3y agoYea, that was a seriously disturbing opinion by the current court. Compare and contrast it with Lemon v. Kurtzman
- dehrmann 3y agoI agree, but I think using this saying is within reasonable bounds compared to a coach leading school-affiliated prayer. The decision even left out the religious that followed.
- Perceval 3y agoI worry that people are now so illiterate that they do not recognize that the "render unto Caesar…" quote is a historical basis for the division between church and state in the Christian world. Astonishingly, they view the Government citing the quote – the origin of separation – as a threat to separation!
- kortex 3y ago"Render unto Caesar" has grown well beyond the bible and is firmly embedded into cultural consciousness.
- Retric 3y agoDo a Google search and count how far down the list you need to get before it isn’t used as a biblical reference.
- dehrmann 3y agohttps://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/render_unto_Caesar_the_things_which_are_Caesar%27s https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/render_unto_Caesar_the_things... While sourced from the Bible, it has a secular-enough meaning that I wouldn't stress it.
- a_e_k 3y agoAh yes. Better watch out. Anyone who uses a Biblical phrase like that might be dastardly "wolf in sheep's clothing" with ulterior motives and not simply "the salt of the earth." Besides, are you sure you've never used such a phrase without thinking about it? "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." I'm sure you'd much rather "do unto others as you would have them do unto you". So maybe just be a charitable "Good Samaritan" and "turn the other cheek", even if you don't really like it, then. After all, "an eye for an eye" policy is fairly unpleasant. Oh, who am I kidding? I'm just "casting pearls before swine" with this audience. (And being as foolish as "the prodigal son", at that.) I can see that "the writing is on the wall," and I won't get anywhere with anyone on this topic. I'll probably even get downvoted for this, but oh well. "Sow the wind" and "reap the whirlwind" as they say. (Hacker News really can be "the blind leading the blind" sometimes.)
- Retric 3y agoAmusing, but are you aware how many of those are referencing works before the Bible?
- whatshisface 3y agoSometimes you don't think that cross-checking cultural references is worth the trouble, but then the chief justice compares the united states to a military dictatorship. :-)
- sirspacey 3y agoIt’s a quote from the Bible (Matthew 22:15-22). Still jarring.
- flangola7 3y agoThat's why it is jarring...
- quickthrower2 3y agoI thought it sounded pompous
- supernova87a 3y agoThe justices of the Supreme Court are highly literate -- as well as literal people. Their livelihoods and judgements rely on the meaning of words. Their opinions draw from history, precedent, Latin, analogy, similarity and they have to communicate it through words, not code. In terms that can convey generally understood meaning and principles without having to rehash entire books to ensure thorough understanding. Opinions have included Shakespeare, poetry, wit, sarcasm. Perhaps you may be disturbed or offended by a phrase that happens to come from the bible. Others are not, and take it simply as a historical analogy. I'm not Christian and I don't find it disturbing. You might be getting overly offended in this case.
- grensley 3y agoI'm a big fan of the quote “Be kind to people, be ruthless to systems” and I just don't like to blur the line between the two.
- supernova87a 3y agoAnd what does that mean in this situation? The using of a historical analogy in a legal opinion contributes to making our government have the appearance of a dictatorship?
- grensley 3y agoJust a general trend of humanizing things that aren't human: governments, corporations, AI.
- supernova87a 3y agoThe opinion in this case prevented a "evil" government entity from taking an individual's property unjustly, and was written by a person using anecdotes and references to people. So honestly I don't know what you're on about.
- Turing_Machine 3y agoCaesar (most likely Tiberius) was most definitely "the government". The full context of the quote is specifically about rendering taxes to the government, so I think the quote is fully on-point.