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> That's spiritual stuff; It's also physics, those notes sound good next to each other because mathematically their frequencies are resonant (simple relationsh

> That's spiritual stuff; It's also physics, those notes sound good next to each other because mathematically their frequencies are resonant (simple relationships like 3/2 or 5/4 as opposed to, say, 729/512 of a tritone). I'm not saying that it's not awesome that this scale is still in use (it is) or that hearing that flute doesn't make me emotional (it does), just noting that there is a reason why.

mandmandam 3y ago
That's true, and it's important. Still, it seems very likely those Neanderthals 60k years ago were playing music for all the same reasons we do, even making efforts to understand the principles enough to make clever instruments. Maybe the Neanderthals even knew about such ratios. It's discoverable by playing with string, or even plants.
- WalterBright 3y ago
  If you just blow into a tube, it will resonate and make a sound. It's not far from that to notice that different length tubes make different notes. Eventually someone found that blowing in a tube with a hole in the side will change the note if one blocks the hole with a finger. By then, one is off and running with developing a workable flute.
  - earleybird 3y ago
    Then someone discovers you can add a reed. Et voila, the woodwind section appears :-) Alternate ending: "suddenly jazz appears"
williamcotton 3y ago
There’s a bit more to the story than just harmonic overtones. If you stack fifths on top of each other you also get the major pentatonic scale, like going from noon to 4 o’clock on the circle of fifths. If you keep going around you basically spell out the major scale, other than the sharp 4, and this is the foundation of Russell’s Lydian chromatic scale. The 5/3 ration of the fifth note (A in the C major pentatonic scale) is already evidence that there is some kind of stacked tonality. So yes, it is still physics, but there is definitely a level of complexity above just simple ratios against a root note! You can take the harmonic series farther up, specifically in the range between the 8th and 16th overtones, and get a scale that is very close to containing the major pentatonic, close to a C7#4, but it sounds a little off outside of equal temperament!

mandmandam 3y ago

That's true, and it's important. Still, it seems very likely those Neanderthals 60k years ago were playing music for all the same reasons we do, even making efforts to understand the principles enough to make clever instruments. Maybe the Neanderthals even knew about such ratios. It's discoverable by playing with string, or even plants.

WalterBright 3y ago
If you just blow into a tube, it will resonate and make a sound. It's not far from that to notice that different length tubes make different notes. Eventually someone found that blowing in a tube with a hole in the side will change the note if one blocks the hole with a finger. By then, one is off and running with developing a workable flute.
- earleybird 3y ago
  Then someone discovers you can add a reed. Et voila, the woodwind section appears :-) Alternate ending: "suddenly jazz appears"

williamcotton 3y ago

There’s a bit more to the story than just harmonic overtones. If you stack fifths on top of each other you also get the major pentatonic scale, like going from noon to 4 o’clock on the circle of fifths. If you keep going around you basically spell out the major scale, other than the sharp 4, and this is the foundation of Russell’s Lydian chromatic scale. The 5/3 ration of the fifth note (A in the C major pentatonic scale) is already evidence that there is some kind of stacked tonality. So yes, it is still physics, but there is definitely a level of complexity above just simple ratios against a root note! You can take the harmonic series farther up, specifically in the range between the 8th and 16th overtones, and get a scale that is very close to containing the major pentatonic, close to a C7#4, but it sounds a little off outside of equal temperament!