5 ms·

Sounds like this isn't about carbon, then. It's about control. There are already electric aircraft either in the works or soon available that could handle short

Sounds like this isn't about carbon, then. It's about control. There are already electric aircraft either in the works or soon available that could handle short-haul flights all day long, but if they're interested in preventing this from even becoming possible that just speaks volumes to what their real intentions are.

standardUser 3y ago
Saying something is "about control" is not an argument. The onus is on you to explain who is seizing this control and to what end, and with enough evidence and logical consistency that it's not just another of the million baseless conspiracy theories we're all sick of hearing about.
- ThorsBane 3y ago
  It's blatantly clear who is seizing control and to what end. It's literally in the article headline and description. Some bureacrats are invoking a lie around carbon emissions to ground their population so that people can't fly anymore. Pretending otherwise or putting your head in the sand by pretending the onus is on someone else ain't it.
  - standardUser 3y ago
    You still haven't fleshed out a decent conspiracy theory. WHICH bureaucrats are intent on preventing people from flying? WHAT do they gain by achieving this end?
phtrivier 3y ago
> There are already electric aircraft either in the works or soon available that could handle short-haul flights all day long I'm afraid, no, not "soon".
- ThorsBane 3y ago
  You're wrong. There are 9-seater craft that already had maiden voyages at the start of the year. Those will just increase in size and range. Progress in tech is moving very fast including in electric airplanes and France could accomplish it's claimed goals around emissions without bans.
  - bluGill 3y ago
    I've seen enough aviation startups get that far and fail to be pessimistic about those actually getting to production. Though there is hope.
    - ThorsBane 3y ago
      Fair enough, it's a hard problem to work on indeed. But I would ask, why not raise investment then? Why is the solution a ban, when we have working prototypes that get better every month and that have done maiden voyages? The solution is larger investments and partnerships into more R&D on these crafts, not to shutter the prospect entirely...
      - phtrivier 3y ago
        My point is precisely that: those investments are happening, that R&D is happening, and electric planes will happen, and they will reach commercial scale at some point. And when then do (I would probably bet "in 10 to 15 years", and I would absolutely bet "later than you're optimisticly hoping", because that's what the people making the planes are saying [1] [2]), then the bans won't make sense, sure. At some point. But the emphasis is _AT SOME POINT_, where the commercial fossil fuel propelled planes are travelling and emitting _RIGHT NOW_. The best time to reduce the number of flights was 20 years ago, the second best time is now. MEANWHILE... [1] https://www.dw.com/en/are-electric-planes-ready-for-takeoff/a-64491147 https://www.dw.com/en/are-electric-planes-ready-for-takeoff/... [2] https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/stories/2023-03-electrifying-the-sky https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/stories/2023-03-electrify...

standardUser 3y ago

Saying something is "about control" is not an argument. The onus is on you to explain who is seizing this control and to what end, and with enough evidence and logical consistency that it's not just another of the million baseless conspiracy theories we're all sick of hearing about.

ThorsBane 3y ago
It's blatantly clear who is seizing control and to what end. It's literally in the article headline and description. Some bureacrats are invoking a lie around carbon emissions to ground their population so that people can't fly anymore. Pretending otherwise or putting your head in the sand by pretending the onus is on someone else ain't it.
- standardUser 3y ago
  You still haven't fleshed out a decent conspiracy theory. WHICH bureaucrats are intent on preventing people from flying? WHAT do they gain by achieving this end?

phtrivier 3y ago

> There are already electric aircraft either in the works or soon available that could handle short-haul flights all day long I'm afraid, no, not "soon".

ThorsBane 3y ago
You're wrong. There are 9-seater craft that already had maiden voyages at the start of the year. Those will just increase in size and range. Progress in tech is moving very fast including in electric airplanes and France could accomplish it's claimed goals around emissions without bans.
- bluGill 3y ago
  I've seen enough aviation startups get that far and fail to be pessimistic about those actually getting to production. Though there is hope.
  - ThorsBane 3y ago
    Fair enough, it's a hard problem to work on indeed. But I would ask, why not raise investment then? Why is the solution a ban, when we have working prototypes that get better every month and that have done maiden voyages? The solution is larger investments and partnerships into more R&D on these crafts, not to shutter the prospect entirely...
    - phtrivier 3y ago
      My point is precisely that: those investments are happening, that R&D is happening, and electric planes will happen, and they will reach commercial scale at some point. And when then do (I would probably bet "in 10 to 15 years", and I would absolutely bet "later than you're optimisticly hoping", because that's what the people making the planes are saying [1] [2]), then the bans won't make sense, sure. At some point. But the emphasis is _AT SOME POINT_, where the commercial fossil fuel propelled planes are travelling and emitting _RIGHT NOW_. The best time to reduce the number of flights was 20 years ago, the second best time is now. MEANWHILE... [1] https://www.dw.com/en/are-electric-planes-ready-for-takeoff/a-64491147 https://www.dw.com/en/are-electric-planes-ready-for-takeoff/... [2] https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/stories/2023-03-electrifying-the-sky https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/stories/2023-03-electrify...