4 ms·

CEO lays people off, forfeits their bonus [because they failed their responsibility to the employees] and then perhaps also resigns [because they failed their r

CEO lays people off, forfeits their bonus [because they failed their responsibility to the employees] and then perhaps also resigns [because they failed their responsibility to the shareholders]

lazide 3y ago
Then CEO is broke - and people make fun of him for that. Leading based on other people’s complaint’s doesn’t work for anyone because people always have complaints no matter what.
- foldr 3y ago
  >Leading based on other people’s complaint’s doesn’t work for anyone because people always have complaints no matter what. I guess that means that the behavior of CEOs is beyond criticism, then. Convenient!
  - lazide 3y ago
    And how did you get that? If the board doesn’t like the CEO (taking into account whatever criticism they think is fair), they fire him. The CEO running constant opinion polls? Not helpful.
    - foldr 3y ago
      Who’s asking anyone to run opinion poles? People are just offering their own opinions of the CEO’s actions. If that’s somehow not ok then it seems like you’re saying that people shouldn’t criticize CEOs.
      - lazide 3y ago
        I think you might have lost context. The comment sub thread starts with ‘[CEO lays people off but does not resign] “You’re not taking responsibility!” [CEO lays people off and does resign] “You’re shirking responsibility in order to get your bonus!”’ And the reply was similar. My comments seem entirely appropriate in the context - which is none of this makes any difference to any CEO that is doing their job.
        foldr 3y ago
        The context is this comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36056775 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36056775 Someone responded basically saying that the CEO would be criticized whatever he did. That may be true, but it obviously doesn’t entail that all such criticism is invalid. For example, Joe Biden will be criticized by someone whatever he does, but that doesn’t mean that all criticisms of Joe Biden are equally valid or that no-one should criticize him.
        lazide 3y ago
        That was my comment you’re referring to. I’m not saying the criticism is invalid. Rather, pointless without action/traction. But we all have to let the hot air out somehow eh?
        foldr 3y ago
        The attitude here does seem to be that public scrutiny of CEOs’ actions is just ‘hot air’. This is a political issue, not simply a case of back seat driving.
        lazide 3y ago
        IMO, it’s mostly hot air because it’s confusing causes and effects and is usually blaming someone for something without taking into account the persons job/structural reasons why the decision needed to be made. ‘Boo, CEO laid off 2500 people, that’s terrible’ is pretty useless without looking at the companies TAM, market penetration, margins, etc. because laying off 2500 people may literally be less layoffs than they might need to be doing based on those factors. A company is, generally, a machine for making money as efficiently as possible, and ignoring all those factors before deciding if a decision was valid or not means someone is just complaining/blowing hot air. No one is being hired (almost anywhere I can think of) that could have a reasonable belief of keeping a job that isn’t needed, or doesn’t make sense to the company. Which is valid. Just not necessarily useful for anyone. If someone joins a fishing crew and then when the seasonal catch is bad complains that the captain is terrible because they got laid off/kicked off, all they’re doing is venting. Not providing anything anyone should take seriously, IMO.
- b3lvedere 3y ago
  >Then CEO is broke - and people make fun of him for that. Why would you make fun of an honest hardworking member of society?
  - lazide 3y ago
    Clearly you’ve never met anyone with NPD. There is nothing they can’t find a way to twist. It’s really the fundamental issue - a captain who takes direction from his crew (instead of looking at what is happening and forming their own opinions, and leading from there) is not only not a captain, but dangerous to himself and the crew. It doesn’t mean they don’t listen! Listening is important. But they have to act on their own judgement, or everyone is screwed. And then they take the pros and cons after that, including whatever hate or adoration or whatever results.

CEO lays people off, forfeits their bonus [because they failed their responsibility to the employees] and then perhaps also resigns [because they failed their responsibility to the shareholders]

lazide 3y ago

Then CEO is broke - and people make fun of him for that. Leading based on other people’s complaint’s doesn’t work for anyone because people always have complaints no matter what.

foldr 3y ago
>Leading based on other people’s complaint’s doesn’t work for anyone because people always have complaints no matter what. I guess that means that the behavior of CEOs is beyond criticism, then. Convenient!
- lazide 3y ago
  And how did you get that? If the board doesn’t like the CEO (taking into account whatever criticism they think is fair), they fire him. The CEO running constant opinion polls? Not helpful.
  - foldr 3y ago
    Who’s asking anyone to run opinion poles? People are just offering their own opinions of the CEO’s actions. If that’s somehow not ok then it seems like you’re saying that people shouldn’t criticize CEOs.
    - lazide 3y ago
      I think you might have lost context. The comment sub thread starts with ‘[CEO lays people off but does not resign] “You’re not taking responsibility!” [CEO lays people off and does resign] “You’re shirking responsibility in order to get your bonus!”’ And the reply was similar. My comments seem entirely appropriate in the context - which is none of this makes any difference to any CEO that is doing their job.
      - foldr 3y ago
        The context is this comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36056775 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36056775 Someone responded basically saying that the CEO would be criticized whatever he did. That may be true, but it obviously doesn’t entail that all such criticism is invalid. For example, Joe Biden will be criticized by someone whatever he does, but that doesn’t mean that all criticisms of Joe Biden are equally valid or that no-one should criticize him.
        lazide 3y ago
        That was my comment you’re referring to. I’m not saying the criticism is invalid. Rather, pointless without action/traction. But we all have to let the hot air out somehow eh?
        foldr 3y ago
        The attitude here does seem to be that public scrutiny of CEOs’ actions is just ‘hot air’. This is a political issue, not simply a case of back seat driving.
        lazide 3y ago
        IMO, it’s mostly hot air because it’s confusing causes and effects and is usually blaming someone for something without taking into account the persons job/structural reasons why the decision needed to be made. ‘Boo, CEO laid off 2500 people, that’s terrible’ is pretty useless without looking at the companies TAM, market penetration, margins, etc. because laying off 2500 people may literally be less layoffs than they might need to be doing based on those factors. A company is, generally, a machine for making money as efficiently as possible, and ignoring all those factors before deciding if a decision was valid or not means someone is just complaining/blowing hot air. No one is being hired (almost anywhere I can think of) that could have a reasonable belief of keeping a job that isn’t needed, or doesn’t make sense to the company. Which is valid. Just not necessarily useful for anyone. If someone joins a fishing crew and then when the seasonal catch is bad complains that the captain is terrible because they got laid off/kicked off, all they’re doing is venting. Not providing anything anyone should take seriously, IMO.
b3lvedere 3y ago
>Then CEO is broke - and people make fun of him for that. Why would you make fun of an honest hardworking member of society?
- lazide 3y ago
  Clearly you’ve never met anyone with NPD. There is nothing they can’t find a way to twist. It’s really the fundamental issue - a captain who takes direction from his crew (instead of looking at what is happening and forming their own opinions, and leading from there) is not only not a captain, but dangerous to himself and the crew. It doesn’t mean they don’t listen! Listening is important. But they have to act on their own judgement, or everyone is screwed. And then they take the pros and cons after that, including whatever hate or adoration or whatever results.