4 ms·

> ‘Don’t you think it’s going to be hard for you‘ I found this curious when reading the article and expected more context as to why this was racist. Why did Ge

> ‘Don’t you think it’s going to be hard for you‘ I found this curious when reading the article and expected more context as to why this was racist. Why did Gebru consider this was due to her race or immigrant status? I got this comment through my whole life too even though I don’t share Gebru’s background or demographic factors. Were my teachers racist? Or were they concerned? Or was the subject just really hard? Or were they classist against my poverty? It seems more info is needed and attributing this to racism (or sexism or xenophobia) seems like an unsupported conclusion. Although it seems Gebru felt it was racist and significant enough to mention in the background for this article. I think this is what makes measuring micro aggressions so difficult. It’s rare to confirm the intent of the person who did something that is perceived as micro aggressions but the recipient feels and infers an intent. I don’t know how to fix this but I want to. I remember once remarking to a coworker that they had a nice car. It was a new 7-series and looked really nice. I thought nothing of it as it was just small talk and I frequently make such small comments to note something positive. A few months later we were having a large zoom call after the George Floyd murder where people were recounting persistent and systematic racism. My coworker shared an example of what he called everyday racism when someone said he had a nice car and he assumed it was because he was black and couldn’t afford such a nice car. He seemed really hurt and spoke for 5 minutes about it and how he worked really hard to afford the car and his spouse had a high income as well. He didn’t name me as the person who made the comment but it sounded like my small comment. I was so confused as to how all that could be inferred from “nice car.” I don’t know him well enough to ask about it and clear it up. I felt bad he was hurt, even though I just intended it as a small comment recognizing a nice car from a coworker and would have made the comment regardless of his race. So I don’t think I did anything wrong but still feel bad. And there’s no way I could predict such a response. I don’t compliment coworkers cars any longer.

netsharc 3y ago
> I don’t compliment coworkers cars any longer. It's unfortunate, but for you to feel guilty and to stop this seems unreasonable. There are myriad of traps I can imagine you'd be afraid of falling into. Like, "Oh I want lunch and I fancy some fried chicken. Oh wait if I invite [black colleague] will they be offended at the suggestion to go for that food?" Communication goes through filters, as this cheap graphic shows, and I don't think it's something you can fix on your side: https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fimage.slidesharecdn.com%2Fcommunicationfilters-090401235329-phpapp02%2F95%2Fcommunication-filters-2-728.jpg%3Fcb%3D1238630053&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=5858b72f911f4f2505f2dc3884f900f0fbcdd76329822bd9904ff950d673657d&ipo=images https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2F...
- prepend 3y ago
  To clarify, I don’t feel guilty over my actions and didn’t stop complimenting out of virtue. I stopped to not cause potential harm, or even worse, to be labeled a racist and all the time they would take. I also never suggest friend chicken for lunch. I love fried chicken. I make a pretty good friend chicken. I’m just too timid and over leveraged to risk having it perceived incorrectly.
david38 3y ago
Wow. Totally wrong lesson learned. Go refresh yourself to some hardcore problems and then replay your situation again. A more standard response may be: “oh that was me. Your car is better than mine. Sometimes you know, a compliment is just a compliment.” I’m currently reading Hunting Eichmann. Really nasty stuff that went down, as many know. A very strong reminder that so many of these first-world problems, micro-aggressions, sympathy-seeking woe-is-me public sob stories are just crap. Seriously?? He felt bad from a complement about his car??
lisasays 3y ago
So I don’t think I did anything wrong but still feel bad. And there’s no way I could predict such a response. I feel bad for both of you. This anecdote seems to capture everything wrong with the current climate of discussion on these topics in the US right now.
908B64B197 3y ago
> is perceived as micro aggressions but the recipient feels and infers an intent. > I don't compliment coworkers cars any longer. I'm starting to think these "micro aggressions" are just a way to keep a culture war going, because some groups need a cause to fight for (for political reasons). It reminds me of the whole master vs main debate. A (black) engineer colleague of mine told me about his team's effort to change master to main. The whole initiative was started by a rainbow colored hair (white) PM and since it was what they believed to be a highly visible and easy fix, grew to a team of 5. All non-technical PMs of course. They ended up producing a "manifesto of inclusive software" where they listed every word they considered offensive and what it should be replaced with and made a very public announcement regarding the change. The only response to their email was my (black) colleague asking if the branch renaming could be postponed to after a release because he didn't know what it could break in the build and release automation in case "master" is hard-coded somewhere. This apparently started a lengthy thread between him and the 5 PMs where they explained to him that the reason he wasn't supportive of the change was because of the "systemic and cultural racism" he apparently internalized.
- rayiner 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - onetimeusename 3y ago
    and yet non white people do agree on things like white privilege and microaggressions. Non white people overwhelmingly support politics that reflects a view that white people are racist and privileged. It's seen in things like this poll https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2019/12/17/views-on-race-and-immigration/ https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2019/12/17/views-on-rac.... If the majority of non white people[1] support those politics, how is it a conspiracy by liberal whites? It sounds like it's affirmatively popular to reengineer society. [1]: https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-11-16/poll-many-americans-dont-believe-systemic-racism-exists https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-11-16/...
    - 3y ago

netsharc 3y ago

> I don’t compliment coworkers cars any longer. It's unfortunate, but for you to feel guilty and to stop this seems unreasonable. There are myriad of traps I can imagine you'd be afraid of falling into. Like, "Oh I want lunch and I fancy some fried chicken. Oh wait if I invite [black colleague] will they be offended at the suggestion to go for that food?" Communication goes through filters, as this cheap graphic shows, and I don't think it's something you can fix on your side: https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fimage.slidesharecdn.com%2Fcommunicationfilters-090401235329-phpapp02%2F95%2Fcommunication-filters-2-728.jpg%3Fcb%3D1238630053&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=5858b72f911f4f2505f2dc3884f900f0fbcdd76329822bd9904ff950d673657d&ipo=images https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2F...

prepend 3y ago
To clarify, I don’t feel guilty over my actions and didn’t stop complimenting out of virtue. I stopped to not cause potential harm, or even worse, to be labeled a racist and all the time they would take. I also never suggest friend chicken for lunch. I love fried chicken. I make a pretty good friend chicken. I’m just too timid and over leveraged to risk having it perceived incorrectly.

david38 3y ago

Wow. Totally wrong lesson learned. Go refresh yourself to some hardcore problems and then replay your situation again. A more standard response may be: “oh that was me. Your car is better than mine. Sometimes you know, a compliment is just a compliment.” I’m currently reading Hunting Eichmann. Really nasty stuff that went down, as many know. A very strong reminder that so many of these first-world problems, micro-aggressions, sympathy-seeking woe-is-me public sob stories are just crap. Seriously?? He felt bad from a complement about his car??

lisasays 3y ago

So I don’t think I did anything wrong but still feel bad. And there’s no way I could predict such a response. I feel bad for both of you. This anecdote seems to capture everything wrong with the current climate of discussion on these topics in the US right now.

908B64B197 3y ago

> is perceived as micro aggressions but the recipient feels and infers an intent. > I don't compliment coworkers cars any longer. I'm starting to think these "micro aggressions" are just a way to keep a culture war going, because some groups need a cause to fight for (for political reasons). It reminds me of the whole master vs main debate. A (black) engineer colleague of mine told me about his team's effort to change master to main. The whole initiative was started by a rainbow colored hair (white) PM and since it was what they believed to be a highly visible and easy fix, grew to a team of 5. All non-technical PMs of course. They ended up producing a "manifesto of inclusive software" where they listed every word they considered offensive and what it should be replaced with and made a very public announcement regarding the change. The only response to their email was my (black) colleague asking if the branch renaming could be postponed to after a release because he didn't know what it could break in the build and release automation in case "master" is hard-coded somewhere. This apparently started a lengthy thread between him and the 5 PMs where they explained to him that the reason he wasn't supportive of the change was because of the "systemic and cultural racism" he apparently internalized.

rayiner 3y ago
[flagged]
- onetimeusename 3y ago
  and yet non white people do agree on things like white privilege and microaggressions. Non white people overwhelmingly support politics that reflects a view that white people are racist and privileged. It's seen in things like this poll https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2019/12/17/views-on-race-and-immigration/ https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2019/12/17/views-on-rac.... If the majority of non white people[1] support those politics, how is it a conspiracy by liberal whites? It sounds like it's affirmatively popular to reengineer society. [1]: https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-11-16/poll-many-americans-dont-believe-systemic-racism-exists https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-11-16/...
  - 3y ago