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I had no "sheep knowledge" before some quick googling... They are not making it up, extreme gratuitous cruelty has been documented in commercial sheep shearing

I had no "sheep knowledge" before some quick googling... They are not making it up, extreme gratuitous cruelty has been documented in commercial sheep shearing if you care. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCeKbMRlJUU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCeKbMRlJUU That video link was from: https://www.woolfacts.com/wool-and-animal-welfare/shearing/ https://www.woolfacts.com/wool-and-animal-welfare/shearing/ That article goes on to state that the same investigators uncovered cruelty at 117 separate operations, so does not appear to be an isolated incident by, "a few bad apples".

thebooktocome 3y ago
This has nothing to do with a homespun wool contest. This isn’t a commercial setting. As your link mentions, these sheep have been selectively bred to require shearing.
- Gordonjcp 3y ago
  Actually no, the fact that you can shear sheep comes out of the fact that sheep have evolved to shed their wool. When it gets into warmer weather and it's time to shear them, their wool starts to thin, and you get a "rise" - a layer about 5-8mm deep where the individual hairs are about half of their normal thickness. In the wild, these hairs would break and the sheep would shed all its wool in great chunks, but it also makes it a lot easier to shear. If you've tried cutting the "normal" fleece with hand shears you'll know how hard it is, and it will absolutely destroy mechanical clippers. That's not to say that sheep haven't been selectively bred to have a good rise, as well as other desirable characteristics - it's not dog breeding, no-one is trying to select for a deformed snuffly nose to please a dog show judge - but the rise was there before they were domesticated, or they likely wouldn't have survived.
  - uhtred 3y ago
    They have been selectively bred to produce much more wool than is natural, for human benefit. Their ancestors did not require shearing by humans to survive. If you believe otherwise you're an idiot.
    - Gordonjcp 3y ago
      Not really, no. If you look at wild sheep, you'll see they do just the very same thing. Scottish Blackface are about as close to wild as you can get, and they're famed for their wool.
archgoon 3y ago
There are over a hundred thousand sheep farms in the US alone. That's 117 in 6 countries, what percentage of farms had bad practices and how were the ones that were audited chosen? Given that this is PETA, I would not assume good faith here. Finally, the original poster makes a universal claim about the nature of sheep farming, which your above anecdotes do nothing to support.
- uhtred 3y ago
  head in sand time
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
metadat 3y ago
> “Imagine if someone attacked you after … you’d been starved for 24 hours – you wouldn’t have much of a fight.” Actually, I would. 24 hours isn't that long. Adrenaline is a helluva drug. Brutal video, though. Ugh.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
Gordonjcp 3y ago
Ah yes, that video. It was staged. We had one similar in the UK a couple of years back, where a couple of "animal rights activists" got themselves hired at a farm to "document animal cruelty". Not finding any, they set about abusing some animals so they could film it. I think they're still in prison just now, actually.
- uhtred 3y ago
  Funny that you are not being asked to provide evidence for your extreme claim- everyone just upvotes because it makes them feel better about their life choices again.
- uhtred 3y ago
  Come on, where's the evidence it was staged. where is any evidence whatsoever for your claims? Here's some more evidence to support my claims: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/nov/16/secret-videos-reveal-workers-beating-sheep-on-english-and-scottish-farms https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/nov/16/secret-v... https://www.scotsman.com/arts-and-culture/horrific-footage-emerges-claiming-to-show-scottish-shearers-punching-sheep-in-the-face-558505 https://www.scotsman.com/arts-and-culture/horrific-footage-e... https://www.thestatesman.com/supplements/8thday/the-violent-sheep-wool-shearing-process-1502759047.html https://www.thestatesman.com/supplements/8thday/the-violent-...
  - Gordonjcp 3y ago
    Three tabloid newspapers of the "Freddy Starr Ate My Hamster" degree of believability. Okay then.

thebooktocome 3y ago

This has nothing to do with a homespun wool contest. This isn’t a commercial setting. As your link mentions, these sheep have been selectively bred to require shearing.

Gordonjcp 3y ago
Actually no, the fact that you can shear sheep comes out of the fact that sheep have evolved to shed their wool. When it gets into warmer weather and it's time to shear them, their wool starts to thin, and you get a "rise" - a layer about 5-8mm deep where the individual hairs are about half of their normal thickness. In the wild, these hairs would break and the sheep would shed all its wool in great chunks, but it also makes it a lot easier to shear. If you've tried cutting the "normal" fleece with hand shears you'll know how hard it is, and it will absolutely destroy mechanical clippers. That's not to say that sheep haven't been selectively bred to have a good rise, as well as other desirable characteristics - it's not dog breeding, no-one is trying to select for a deformed snuffly nose to please a dog show judge - but the rise was there before they were domesticated, or they likely wouldn't have survived.
- uhtred 3y ago
  They have been selectively bred to produce much more wool than is natural, for human benefit. Their ancestors did not require shearing by humans to survive. If you believe otherwise you're an idiot.
  - Gordonjcp 3y ago
    Not really, no. If you look at wild sheep, you'll see they do just the very same thing. Scottish Blackface are about as close to wild as you can get, and they're famed for their wool.

archgoon 3y ago

There are over a hundred thousand sheep farms in the US alone. That's 117 in 6 countries, what percentage of farms had bad practices and how were the ones that were audited chosen? Given that this is PETA, I would not assume good faith here. Finally, the original poster makes a universal claim about the nature of sheep farming, which your above anecdotes do nothing to support.

uhtred 3y ago
head in sand time
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

metadat 3y ago

> “Imagine if someone attacked you after … you’d been starved for 24 hours – you wouldn’t have much of a fight.” Actually, I would. 24 hours isn't that long. Adrenaline is a helluva drug. Brutal video, though. Ugh.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

Gordonjcp 3y ago

Ah yes, that video. It was staged. We had one similar in the UK a couple of years back, where a couple of "animal rights activists" got themselves hired at a farm to "document animal cruelty". Not finding any, they set about abusing some animals so they could film it. I think they're still in prison just now, actually.

uhtred 3y ago
Funny that you are not being asked to provide evidence for your extreme claim- everyone just upvotes because it makes them feel better about their life choices again.
uhtred 3y ago
Come on, where's the evidence it was staged. where is any evidence whatsoever for your claims? Here's some more evidence to support my claims: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/nov/16/secret-videos-reveal-workers-beating-sheep-on-english-and-scottish-farms https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/nov/16/secret-v... https://www.scotsman.com/arts-and-culture/horrific-footage-emerges-claiming-to-show-scottish-shearers-punching-sheep-in-the-face-558505 https://www.scotsman.com/arts-and-culture/horrific-footage-e... https://www.thestatesman.com/supplements/8thday/the-violent-sheep-wool-shearing-process-1502759047.html https://www.thestatesman.com/supplements/8thday/the-violent-...
- Gordonjcp 3y ago
  Three tabloid newspapers of the "Freddy Starr Ate My Hamster" degree of believability. Okay then.