5 ms·

Still don't understand why US is so obsessed with credit cards. Debit is much more easy and straight forward, it's the standard in EU. Most of us only have cc t

Still don't understand why US is so obsessed with credit cards. Debit is much more easy and straight forward, it's the standard in EU. Most of us only have cc to purchase stuff from US sites. Why such a complicated solution? Looks like a bank product.

crooked-v 3y ago
You can't use a US debit card online, because functionality for that just doesn't exist in the US banking system. Edit, for clarity: You can't use it as a debit transaction. You can plug it into credit card systems, where it's run as a credit card transaction and interchange fees apply.
- arcticbull 3y ago
  [edit] Edit, for clarity: You can't use it as a debit transaction. You can plug it into credit card systems, where it's run as a credit card transaction and interchange fees apply. That's not actually true. Card-not-present debit is a separate transaction category than card-not-present credit. Durbin requires that debit routing be available for all debit transactions, not just PIN debit. Further, as of October 2022 the Fed amended the Regulation II rule to extend Durbin debit least-cost routing to card-not-present transactions. [2] [1] https://www.cardrates.com/advice/atm-card-vs-debit-card-vs-credit-card/ https://www.cardrates.com/advice/atm-card-vs-debit-card-vs-c... [2] https://cmspi.com/nam/en/resources/content/card-not-present-routing-the-3-billion-opportunity-for-merchants/ https://cmspi.com/nam/en/resources/content/card-not-present-...
- CapstanRoller 3y ago
  You absolutely can use USAmerican debit cards for online purchases. You just expose yourself to massive risk by doing so (e.g. getting your checking account drained).
  - arcticbull 3y ago
    Your liability is strictly limited in this case - similarly to credit cards, but not identically. Unfortunately you're out the funds until a resolution is reached which can be challenging to say the least.
    - herbst 3y ago
      What is the difference with credit cards? Just recently YouTube charged me 10 times for something and drained my credit card. My bank was clueless and explained I get the money back within 4 weeks. Only because YouTube doesn't suck so bad I got the money back within a few days. I never paid for anything on YouTube. Nobody ever explained how that could happen
      - arcticbull 3y ago
        There's a few high-level and a few silly low-level differences. (1) With a credit card, your fraud liability is almost always zero (but technically $50). With a debit card, it varies - I think by law it's $0 if you report the card lost or stolen before it's used, $50 if you report it within 2 days, $500 if you report it within 60 days and unlimited after 60 days. For card-not-present I think it's 60 days for zero liability. (2) With a credit card, you simply don't pay the fraudulent charge until resolved. With a debit card, the money is out of your account until resolved. (3) There's some weird arcana in the Fair Credit Billing Act about common carrier bankruptcy. In some cases, you're not liable if an airline goes bankrupt after you book but before your trip. This doesn't apply to debit cards. [2] [1] https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/credit-cards/credit-card-vs-debit-card-safer-online-purchases https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/credit-cards/credit-card-... [2] https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/service-cessations-bankruptcy https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/service-cessation...
- alibarber 3y ago
  I'm confused - this commenter says the only reason some population of the EU have a credit card is to purchase stuff from US websites. Which to me implies that their EU debit card only works locally. In my corner of the EU - I don't recognise this at all as every debit card you would get from a bank here (as an adult with no bad credit judgements) is Visa branded and works just fine anywhere worldwide that would be set up to handle Visa (electronically at least). People who make a habit of purchasing stuff abroad might well seek out a bank with a low/no currency exchange fee - and it could be that a credit card is more effective here, but it's nothing to do with the fundamental debit vs credit, and once again, simply isn't something that's generalise-able across the entire EU.
  - kalleboo 3y ago
    I believe they're being phased out everywhere now but historically debit cards were something like Maestro, "Visa Electron", EC Card, Girocard, etc. Maybe the GP is still somewhere where those are still in use. I believe Germany is one of the big laggards in this space.
  - herbst 3y ago
    Same here in Switzerland. Most cards I see now have dual use and work as debit and credit card with visa or master. My card works everywhere and even credit card transactions appear as slow debit transactions. I also don't pay any fees for any of that. Only the merchants do in my case.
    - Symbiote 3y ago
      European debit cards work as debit cards, the distinction is the network used. My Danish debit card supports both Visa and Dankort, the Danish network. Danish companies will generally put the transaction through Dankort, as the fees are lower, but it's still a debit transaction if it goes through Visa's network. Dankort only cards begin with the number 5019. Visa+Dankort with 4571. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_card_number https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_card_number
refurb 3y ago
Debit is actually terrible and I've never used it. If there is an error, it your money that is gone until it's fixed. Slightly related, I never allow direct debit from my bank account for things like utilities. It's blanket permission to take money they think they are owed. A friend had a problem with his electricity, the public utility came out, said the meter was tampered with, replaced it and charged him $1000 right from his account. Of course they were wrong. He got the money back, two months later.
- jiggywiggy 3y ago
  Not true. It depends on how you pay. Most automatislc payments in EU are actually SEPA Payments and are much easier to revert. One click in your bank app or online, within 3 months no arguing.

crooked-v 3y ago

You can't use a US debit card online, because functionality for that just doesn't exist in the US banking system. Edit, for clarity: You can't use it as a debit transaction. You can plug it into credit card systems, where it's run as a credit card transaction and interchange fees apply.

arcticbull 3y ago
[edit] Edit, for clarity: You can't use it as a debit transaction. You can plug it into credit card systems, where it's run as a credit card transaction and interchange fees apply. That's not actually true. Card-not-present debit is a separate transaction category than card-not-present credit. Durbin requires that debit routing be available for all debit transactions, not just PIN debit. Further, as of October 2022 the Fed amended the Regulation II rule to extend Durbin debit least-cost routing to card-not-present transactions. [2] [1] https://www.cardrates.com/advice/atm-card-vs-debit-card-vs-credit-card/ https://www.cardrates.com/advice/atm-card-vs-debit-card-vs-c... [2] https://cmspi.com/nam/en/resources/content/card-not-present-routing-the-3-billion-opportunity-for-merchants/ https://cmspi.com/nam/en/resources/content/card-not-present-...
CapstanRoller 3y ago
You absolutely can use USAmerican debit cards for online purchases. You just expose yourself to massive risk by doing so (e.g. getting your checking account drained).
- arcticbull 3y ago
  Your liability is strictly limited in this case - similarly to credit cards, but not identically. Unfortunately you're out the funds until a resolution is reached which can be challenging to say the least.
  - herbst 3y ago
    What is the difference with credit cards? Just recently YouTube charged me 10 times for something and drained my credit card. My bank was clueless and explained I get the money back within 4 weeks. Only because YouTube doesn't suck so bad I got the money back within a few days. I never paid for anything on YouTube. Nobody ever explained how that could happen
    - arcticbull 3y ago
      There's a few high-level and a few silly low-level differences. (1) With a credit card, your fraud liability is almost always zero (but technically $50). With a debit card, it varies - I think by law it's $0 if you report the card lost or stolen before it's used, $50 if you report it within 2 days, $500 if you report it within 60 days and unlimited after 60 days. For card-not-present I think it's 60 days for zero liability. (2) With a credit card, you simply don't pay the fraudulent charge until resolved. With a debit card, the money is out of your account until resolved. (3) There's some weird arcana in the Fair Credit Billing Act about common carrier bankruptcy. In some cases, you're not liable if an airline goes bankrupt after you book but before your trip. This doesn't apply to debit cards. [2] [1] https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/credit-cards/credit-card-vs-debit-card-safer-online-purchases https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/credit-cards/credit-card-... [2] https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/service-cessations-bankruptcy https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/service-cessation...
alibarber 3y ago
I'm confused - this commenter says the only reason some population of the EU have a credit card is to purchase stuff from US websites. Which to me implies that their EU debit card only works locally. In my corner of the EU - I don't recognise this at all as every debit card you would get from a bank here (as an adult with no bad credit judgements) is Visa branded and works just fine anywhere worldwide that would be set up to handle Visa (electronically at least). People who make a habit of purchasing stuff abroad might well seek out a bank with a low/no currency exchange fee - and it could be that a credit card is more effective here, but it's nothing to do with the fundamental debit vs credit, and once again, simply isn't something that's generalise-able across the entire EU.
- kalleboo 3y ago
  I believe they're being phased out everywhere now but historically debit cards were something like Maestro, "Visa Electron", EC Card, Girocard, etc. Maybe the GP is still somewhere where those are still in use. I believe Germany is one of the big laggards in this space.
- herbst 3y ago
  Same here in Switzerland. Most cards I see now have dual use and work as debit and credit card with visa or master. My card works everywhere and even credit card transactions appear as slow debit transactions. I also don't pay any fees for any of that. Only the merchants do in my case.
  - Symbiote 3y ago
    European debit cards work as debit cards, the distinction is the network used. My Danish debit card supports both Visa and Dankort, the Danish network. Danish companies will generally put the transaction through Dankort, as the fees are lower, but it's still a debit transaction if it goes through Visa's network. Dankort only cards begin with the number 5019. Visa+Dankort with 4571. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_card_number https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_card_number

refurb 3y ago

Debit is actually terrible and I've never used it. If there is an error, it your money that is gone until it's fixed. Slightly related, I never allow direct debit from my bank account for things like utilities. It's blanket permission to take money they think they are owed. A friend had a problem with his electricity, the public utility came out, said the meter was tampered with, replaced it and charged him $1000 right from his account. Of course they were wrong. He got the money back, two months later.

jiggywiggy 3y ago
Not true. It depends on how you pay. Most automatislc payments in EU are actually SEPA Payments and are much easier to revert. One click in your bank app or online, within 3 months no arguing.