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Tomorrow's story: "Residents of Montana discover VPNs and how to use them!" Between Utah and Montana the awareness and use of VPNs is rising among the non-secu

by mikece 3y ago

Tomorrow's story: "Residents of Montana discover VPNs and how to use them!" Between Utah and Montana the awareness and use of VPNs is rising among the non-security-conscious, and this is a good thing.

woooooo 3y ago
I saw a BBC story the other week bemoaning how state college students were circumventing firewalls of foreign media using VPNs.. the irony seemed to be lost on them.
- RugnirViking 3y ago
  could you link to the story?
  - woooooo 3y ago
    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-64827885 https://www.bbc.com/news/business-64827885
    - RugnirViking 3y ago
      that seems to be pretty even handed to me
mmh0000 3y ago
So, I avoided VPNs for years because they had no practical benefit. I live in Utah, and I would consider myself very technically adept. Previously, I didn't like "VPNs" because now I'm just routing all my traffic through another untrusted 3rd party. It's like choosing between two evils, would I prefer my ISP knows where I go, or some rando that I also have to pay? Worse, the "rando" (usually) requires a VPN app which could get up to all sorts of fuckery. So. yada yada yada. Well, then, two things happened back-to-back. The VPN provider Mullvad was unsuccessfully raided, and Utah passed hyper-totalitarian laws. On the recent PR news, I investigated Mullval, and... they're fantastic. You don't have to use their app; they support straight openvpn or wireguard and are Linux native. AND I can pay them in BTC, further obscuring myself. Because of Utah's law, the vast majority of my traffic is now directed over a VPN. I don't even really go to porn sites all that often. It's more the principle of it. The more the state pushes to limit and remove freedoms, the more I will do everything in my power to push the other way. It's the Hacker Mindset =D
- throwaway5959 3y ago
  What’s your threshold for leaving the state?
- Jemaclus 3y ago
  I generally have the same thought process (rather go through ISP than VPN) but one angle of this thought that I've struggled with is: what makes my ISP any less of a rando than the VPN that I choose? At least I have more choices with my VPN than with my ISP... ...but I still haven't bitten the bullet on a VPN yet.
  - int_19h 3y ago
    Running your own VPN server in the cloud in whatever jurisdiction you find the most appealing is also an option.
  - zamnos 3y ago
    The problem is your ISP is bound to your physical location and is forced to obey the laws in that jurisdiction in order to continue operating there. The VPN provider, especially one in another country, has no such concerns. In mmh0000's case, they're in Utah and don't wish to follow Utah's laws. Thus it's that the VPN being able to be a rando, and the ISP being very much not is central to using a VPN over having to trust the ISP, which very much knows exactly where you live. See also: Monty Hall problem
- flagrant_taco 3y ago
  > and Utah passed hyper-totalitarian laws I haven't actually seen anything about a Utah law yet, only the Montana ban of TikTok. What exactly does "hyper-totalitarian" mean compared to totalitarian, and what was the Utah law passed recently?
  - sphars 3y ago
    Utah has passed a law that requires age verification to view porn: https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/utah-law-requiring-porn-sites-verify-user-ages-99059621 https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/utah-law-requiring-porn-...
jliptzin 3y ago
The party of "small government" just continuing about their usual business...
threeseed 3y ago
VPNs don't help in this case. You would need to setup a new Apple ID/Google account with no credit card billing information. And then deal with all of the inconvenience that entails i.e. no more paid apps, need to cancel subscriptions etc.
1letterunixname 3y ago
It still marks Montana as a third-world state without conventional freedoms.
thomastjeffery 3y ago
Not really. VPNs don't help your privacy outside specific niche use cases. The only reason to use a VPN is when you want to hide your IP address from the other end of your communication. You get effectively the same service from public WiFi at a cafe. Most non-technical people I hear talking about VPNs get them completely confused with encryption. VPNs do not hide the content of your communication: that is already happening with SSL.

by mikece 3y ago

woooooo 3y ago

I saw a BBC story the other week bemoaning how state college students were circumventing firewalls of foreign media using VPNs.. the irony seemed to be lost on them.

RugnirViking 3y ago
could you link to the story?
- woooooo 3y ago
  https://www.bbc.com/news/business-64827885 https://www.bbc.com/news/business-64827885
  - RugnirViking 3y ago
    that seems to be pretty even handed to me

mmh0000 3y ago

So, I avoided VPNs for years because they had no practical benefit. I live in Utah, and I would consider myself very technically adept. Previously, I didn't like "VPNs" because now I'm just routing all my traffic through another untrusted 3rd party. It's like choosing between two evils, would I prefer my ISP knows where I go, or some rando that I also have to pay? Worse, the "rando" (usually) requires a VPN app which could get up to all sorts of fuckery. So. yada yada yada. Well, then, two things happened back-to-back. The VPN provider Mullvad was unsuccessfully raided, and Utah passed hyper-totalitarian laws. On the recent PR news, I investigated Mullval, and... they're fantastic. You don't have to use their app; they support straight openvpn or wireguard and are Linux native. AND I can pay them in BTC, further obscuring myself. Because of Utah's law, the vast majority of my traffic is now directed over a VPN. I don't even really go to porn sites all that often. It's more the principle of it. The more the state pushes to limit and remove freedoms, the more I will do everything in my power to push the other way. It's the Hacker Mindset =D

throwaway5959 3y ago
What’s your threshold for leaving the state?
Jemaclus 3y ago
I generally have the same thought process (rather go through ISP than VPN) but one angle of this thought that I've struggled with is: what makes my ISP any less of a rando than the VPN that I choose? At least I have more choices with my VPN than with my ISP... ...but I still haven't bitten the bullet on a VPN yet.
- int_19h 3y ago
  Running your own VPN server in the cloud in whatever jurisdiction you find the most appealing is also an option.
- zamnos 3y ago
  The problem is your ISP is bound to your physical location and is forced to obey the laws in that jurisdiction in order to continue operating there. The VPN provider, especially one in another country, has no such concerns. In mmh0000's case, they're in Utah and don't wish to follow Utah's laws. Thus it's that the VPN being able to be a rando, and the ISP being very much not is central to using a VPN over having to trust the ISP, which very much knows exactly where you live. See also: Monty Hall problem
flagrant_taco 3y ago
> and Utah passed hyper-totalitarian laws I haven't actually seen anything about a Utah law yet, only the Montana ban of TikTok. What exactly does "hyper-totalitarian" mean compared to totalitarian, and what was the Utah law passed recently?
- sphars 3y ago
  Utah has passed a law that requires age verification to view porn: https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/utah-law-requiring-porn-sites-verify-user-ages-99059621 https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/utah-law-requiring-porn-...

jliptzin 3y ago

The party of "small government" just continuing about their usual business...

threeseed 3y ago

VPNs don't help in this case. You would need to setup a new Apple ID/Google account with no credit card billing information. And then deal with all of the inconvenience that entails i.e. no more paid apps, need to cancel subscriptions etc.

1letterunixname 3y ago

It still marks Montana as a third-world state without conventional freedoms.

thomastjeffery 3y ago

Not really. VPNs don't help your privacy outside specific niche use cases. The only reason to use a VPN is when you want to hide your IP address from the other end of your communication. You get effectively the same service from public WiFi at a cafe. Most non-technical people I hear talking about VPNs get them completely confused with encryption. VPNs do not hide the content of your communication: that is already happening with SSL.