5 ms·

I have had better luck with orbstack (https://orbstack.dev https://orbstack.dev)

0xbadcafebee 3y ago
Colima/Lima already support more features than OrbStack, and are FOSS, and OrbStack will soon become a paid product (like Docker Desktop), so I would recommend either Colima or Docker Desktop instead.
- kdrag0n 3y ago
  (I work on OrbStack.) Fair point. Any missing features that you've noticed in particular? Edit: OrbStack will also most likely remain free for personal non-commercial use.
  - _cenw 3y ago
    Please have a personal license that allows commercial use by the licensee, often it's hard to convince your company to get something just for you and I'm happy to pay for a tool I already use so I don't have to context switch. (I did so for Obsidian and Berkeley Mono).
    - jpgvm 3y ago
      To add to this I have purchased my own Jetbrains All Products subscription for many years now for exactly this reason. I bring my tools with me, I want to use them on commercial products I develop for companies I work for and I don't want the hassle of them trying to license software for me. This is the status quo for Java tools at the very least, i.e IDEA, YourKit, etc.
    - kdrag0n 3y ago
      Yes, you'll be able to purchase the commercial+business use license yourself. It won't be limited to companies. Subject to change before launch, but initial plans are $8/user/mo: https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1656326409995055104 https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1656326409995055104
      - _cenw 3y ago
        $100 a year seems pretty steep for a tool like this; to compare, that is also the price for Parallels Desktop.
        kdrag0n 3y ago
        Docker Desktop: $84-132/yr Parallels Desktop Pro (no resource limitations): $120/yr OrbStack: $96/yr Seems very reasonable, especially for a tool that does most of what Docker Desktop and Parallels do combined (but better in most cases), and it'll only improve over time.
        _cenw 3y ago
        Except Parallels also gives you an entire desktop experience, including the maybe best Windows on ARM experience in existence (thanks to Qualcomm). That is a lot of utility. OrbStack just feels like an upgrade to (co)lima on the other hand that I'd get for the added comfort, nice GUI and marginal performance uplift (though props for having cgroupv2 dockerd). But not because it actually provides capabilities that I can't get elsewhere, from sources where I don't have to consider licensing and building my scripts on top of something someone might not be able to use. And I'm not sure the comparison with Docker Desktop is warranted. They're basically doing continuity extortion.
- qbasic_forever 3y ago
  Podman is an open source option on all platforms too. On Mac and Windows it runs a VM with Linux just like Docker Desktop, colima, etc. https://podman.io/docs/installation https://podman.io/docs/installation
  - emptysongglass 3y ago
    And Podman Desktop now ships with kind for K8s!
tuanm 3y ago
Pretty perspective, but still so far to institute Docker.
- kdrag0n 3y ago
  (I work on OrbStack.) Care to elaborate a bit on why?
kdrag0n 3y ago
I work on OrbStack. Thanks for the mention — happy to answer questions!
- emptysongglass 3y ago
  When K8s?
maxmouchet 3y ago
It's a bit disappointing that OrbStack is not open source, but it works really well. In my experience (co)lima was already an improvement over Docker Desktop in terms of reliability and background resource usage, but OrbStack is even more lightweight. I also do a bit of low-level networking development and Docker Desktop was rewriting some fields of the IP packets (besides NAT translation) which was annoying. It works seamlessly here. It still has the same VM memory usage issue as other tools (Linux page cache taking more and more memory over time and not releasing it to the host), but they claim it will work correctly once a bug in Virtualization.framework is fixed: https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1645782250116505600 https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1645782250116505600
- kdrag0n 3y ago
  Great to hear, thanks for sharing :) Here's to hoping that Apple fixes the underlying memory bug in macOS 14. Being able to ship dynamic memory would be amazing!

Colima/Lima already support more features than OrbStack, and are FOSS, and OrbStack will soon become a paid product (like Docker Desktop), so I would recommend either Colima or Docker Desktop instead.

kdrag0n 3y ago
(I work on OrbStack.) Fair point. Any missing features that you've noticed in particular? Edit: OrbStack will also most likely remain free for personal non-commercial use.
- _cenw 3y ago
  Please have a personal license that allows commercial use by the licensee, often it's hard to convince your company to get something just for you and I'm happy to pay for a tool I already use so I don't have to context switch. (I did so for Obsidian and Berkeley Mono).
  - jpgvm 3y ago
    To add to this I have purchased my own Jetbrains All Products subscription for many years now for exactly this reason. I bring my tools with me, I want to use them on commercial products I develop for companies I work for and I don't want the hassle of them trying to license software for me. This is the status quo for Java tools at the very least, i.e IDEA, YourKit, etc.
  - kdrag0n 3y ago
    Yes, you'll be able to purchase the commercial+business use license yourself. It won't be limited to companies. Subject to change before launch, but initial plans are $8/user/mo: https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1656326409995055104 https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1656326409995055104
    - _cenw 3y ago
      $100 a year seems pretty steep for a tool like this; to compare, that is also the price for Parallels Desktop.
      - kdrag0n 3y ago
        Docker Desktop: $84-132/yr Parallels Desktop Pro (no resource limitations): $120/yr OrbStack: $96/yr Seems very reasonable, especially for a tool that does most of what Docker Desktop and Parallels do combined (but better in most cases), and it'll only improve over time.
        _cenw 3y ago
        Except Parallels also gives you an entire desktop experience, including the maybe best Windows on ARM experience in existence (thanks to Qualcomm). That is a lot of utility. OrbStack just feels like an upgrade to (co)lima on the other hand that I'd get for the added comfort, nice GUI and marginal performance uplift (though props for having cgroupv2 dockerd). But not because it actually provides capabilities that I can't get elsewhere, from sources where I don't have to consider licensing and building my scripts on top of something someone might not be able to use. And I'm not sure the comparison with Docker Desktop is warranted. They're basically doing continuity extortion.
qbasic_forever 3y ago
Podman is an open source option on all platforms too. On Mac and Windows it runs a VM with Linux just like Docker Desktop, colima, etc. https://podman.io/docs/installation https://podman.io/docs/installation
- emptysongglass 3y ago
  And Podman Desktop now ships with kind for K8s!

tuanm 3y ago

Pretty perspective, but still so far to institute Docker.

kdrag0n 3y ago
(I work on OrbStack.) Care to elaborate a bit on why?

kdrag0n 3y ago

I work on OrbStack. Thanks for the mention — happy to answer questions!

emptysongglass 3y ago
When K8s?

maxmouchet 3y ago

It's a bit disappointing that OrbStack is not open source, but it works really well. In my experience (co)lima was already an improvement over Docker Desktop in terms of reliability and background resource usage, but OrbStack is even more lightweight. I also do a bit of low-level networking development and Docker Desktop was rewriting some fields of the IP packets (besides NAT translation) which was annoying. It works seamlessly here. It still has the same VM memory usage issue as other tools (Linux page cache taking more and more memory over time and not releasing it to the host), but they claim it will work correctly once a bug in Virtualization.framework is fixed: https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1645782250116505600 https://twitter.com/OrbStack/status/1645782250116505600

kdrag0n 3y ago
Great to hear, thanks for sharing :) Here's to hoping that Apple fixes the underlying memory bug in macOS 14. Being able to ship dynamic memory would be amazing!