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It's horrific in the UK for those that don't own - I've got friends (a couple - he's a teacher, she's a nurse) who in any reasonable society should be able to e

It's horrific in the UK for those that don't own - I've got friends (a couple - he's a teacher, she's a nurse) who in any reasonable society should be able to easily afford to own a decent house, but finding themselves stuck in the rental trap are unable to make plans six months ahead, let alone think about starting a family because they never know if / when they might be evicted. This is in a costal area 1.5 hours from London and for the past two years they've found themsleves evicted in the Spring as the landlord can make more money AirBNBing over the summer.

simonswords82 3y ago
DINK in professional jobs and 1.5 hours from London and still can’t save money for a deposit? Not being unreasonable towards your friends but are they responsible with money?
- baggsie 3y ago
  They're in the process of saving up - family housing in a non stabby areas are really expensive and they need over one years net salary for a deposit(Poole / Bournemouth).
Aromasin 3y ago
Just to add to fire to this, it's not just teacher/nurses (who are criminally underpaid) that are struggling. My partners a teacher, but I'm a chip designer making decent money at a big corporation. We've not gone on Holiday in over a year, turned down almost every social engagement we've been invited to recently, dropped every subscription, grocery shop at Lidl (our cheapest supermarket) and basically pinched every penny we can since we moved in to a rental place a couple of years ago. If my stock plan improves, and we take advantage of all the right savings account, and neither of us need to get a new car, we're on track to buy a house in maybe 6-7 years if we don't have kids by then; which we inevitably will because by then my partner will be too old to conceive. That's just to cover the deposit too. I dread to think what mortgage repayments are going to be like. In the UK, the average savings (net financial wealth) at 25 - 29 years old is £3,800, but the typical person in that age range has -£100. The average UK savings for 30 - 34 year old's is around £14,500 of net financial wealth (savings like current and savings accounts, stocks, bonds, etc. less financial liabilities), but the median figure is just £1,000. That really paints the picture. As a younger person, it really feels like if you don't have wealthy parents to pay your way, you can't ever expect to have financial security in the UK. The island has been bought out by the oligarchs, and a society of indentured slaves in all but name is the eventual outcome. That post WW2 boom, where almost everyone who worked hard could afford a house, car, and a family, feels like a fever dream.
- ojhughes 3y ago
  Do you live in London? I live just over an hour outside and most people I know own a house or flat. You buy a 2 bedroom flat here for 150k. Not denying there is a problem, just surprised you’re finding it so hard as a well paid professional
  - _Wintermute 3y ago
    Where are these 2 bed flats in the south east for 150k?
    - ojhughes 3y ago
      Just a very quick search https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129195644 https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129195644
      - dukeyukey 3y ago
        "just over an hour" might be overstating it, it's more than an hour and a half from Andover station to Paddington, not counting travel/waiting time either side. To go from that house to my companies' office in Holborn in 2 hours, nearly 3 on the return journey. Which _might_ be doable with remote work if you only go in every month or so, but doesn't let you maintain active friendships in and around London the way moving to Watford or Hatfield might.
        ojhughes 3y ago
        I don’t live in Andover it was just an example. There are still lots of jobs within reasonable commuting distance of Andover. I’m fully remote so it’s a non issue
  - Aromasin 3y ago
    No I don't live in London, but also no, I can't live anywhere that I could get a flat for 150k like you've shared below. I work in the semiconductor industry as a hardware engineer; fully remote is unheard of, so I need to live within a commutable vicinity to work. The cities with any SC companies that aren't Defence are Bristol, Oxford, London, or Cambridge. All way over 90 minutes each way in rush hour traffic to Andover. There's a reason the flat you shared is cheap - unless you're commuting to Reading, you're spending hours each day on the motorway. In my current area of Oxford, I'd be looking at minimum 250k for a crap 2 bed flat with furnishings from the 1960s. That's not to even start considering parking, a decent leasehold, and public transport links. Closing on 350k if I dare even consider choosing a freehold house, or a place with a garden. I'd love to get a job Cambridge or London way, as career opportunities are much more abundant, but then I'm looking at nearly 450k for a half decent 2 bed.
ChuckNorris89 3y ago
>It's horrific in the UK for those that don't own It's horrific everywhere if you don't own. Granted, some countries make it difficult to evict someone who isn't paying their rent, but that comes at the cost of landlords explicitly seeking to rent exclusively to people with good jobs or letting the apartment stay empty rather than risking letting someone in who might not be able to pay, with no way of evicting them.
taylodl 3y ago
American here. My wife is a property manager. All I can say is WOW!!! Here in the States, and we're backward on many issues as you're surely well aware, renters have a lot of rights. If you sign a lease, there are very well-defined laws for eviction. It's a tedious process and it even involves engaging the county Sheriff. No kidding. There are even things as an owner you must provider renters: heat, water, heated water, no major plumbing leaks, no exposure to the elements. The renter may not pay the rent, they must put it in escrow, if these items are not being provided and you cannot evict the renter for non-payment in that case. The landlord cannot terminate the lease because they can make more money doing something else. They investigate "slumlords" pretty rigorously, especially given the real estate market we're seeing today. I'm honestly surprised to hear the UK doesn't have all these sorts of protections in place for renters.

simonswords82 3y ago

DINK in professional jobs and 1.5 hours from London and still can’t save money for a deposit? Not being unreasonable towards your friends but are they responsible with money?

baggsie 3y ago
They're in the process of saving up - family housing in a non stabby areas are really expensive and they need over one years net salary for a deposit(Poole / Bournemouth).

Aromasin 3y ago

Just to add to fire to this, it's not just teacher/nurses (who are criminally underpaid) that are struggling. My partners a teacher, but I'm a chip designer making decent money at a big corporation. We've not gone on Holiday in over a year, turned down almost every social engagement we've been invited to recently, dropped every subscription, grocery shop at Lidl (our cheapest supermarket) and basically pinched every penny we can since we moved in to a rental place a couple of years ago. If my stock plan improves, and we take advantage of all the right savings account, and neither of us need to get a new car, we're on track to buy a house in maybe 6-7 years if we don't have kids by then; which we inevitably will because by then my partner will be too old to conceive. That's just to cover the deposit too. I dread to think what mortgage repayments are going to be like. In the UK, the average savings (net financial wealth) at 25 - 29 years old is £3,800, but the typical person in that age range has -£100. The average UK savings for 30 - 34 year old's is around £14,500 of net financial wealth (savings like current and savings accounts, stocks, bonds, etc. less financial liabilities), but the median figure is just £1,000. That really paints the picture. As a younger person, it really feels like if you don't have wealthy parents to pay your way, you can't ever expect to have financial security in the UK. The island has been bought out by the oligarchs, and a society of indentured slaves in all but name is the eventual outcome. That post WW2 boom, where almost everyone who worked hard could afford a house, car, and a family, feels like a fever dream.

ojhughes 3y ago
Do you live in London? I live just over an hour outside and most people I know own a house or flat. You buy a 2 bedroom flat here for 150k. Not denying there is a problem, just surprised you’re finding it so hard as a well paid professional
- _Wintermute 3y ago
  Where are these 2 bed flats in the south east for 150k?
  - ojhughes 3y ago
    Just a very quick search https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129195644 https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129195644
    - dukeyukey 3y ago
      "just over an hour" might be overstating it, it's more than an hour and a half from Andover station to Paddington, not counting travel/waiting time either side. To go from that house to my companies' office in Holborn in 2 hours, nearly 3 on the return journey. Which _might_ be doable with remote work if you only go in every month or so, but doesn't let you maintain active friendships in and around London the way moving to Watford or Hatfield might.
      - ojhughes 3y ago
        I don’t live in Andover it was just an example. There are still lots of jobs within reasonable commuting distance of Andover. I’m fully remote so it’s a non issue
- Aromasin 3y ago
  No I don't live in London, but also no, I can't live anywhere that I could get a flat for 150k like you've shared below. I work in the semiconductor industry as a hardware engineer; fully remote is unheard of, so I need to live within a commutable vicinity to work. The cities with any SC companies that aren't Defence are Bristol, Oxford, London, or Cambridge. All way over 90 minutes each way in rush hour traffic to Andover. There's a reason the flat you shared is cheap - unless you're commuting to Reading, you're spending hours each day on the motorway. In my current area of Oxford, I'd be looking at minimum 250k for a crap 2 bed flat with furnishings from the 1960s. That's not to even start considering parking, a decent leasehold, and public transport links. Closing on 350k if I dare even consider choosing a freehold house, or a place with a garden. I'd love to get a job Cambridge or London way, as career opportunities are much more abundant, but then I'm looking at nearly 450k for a half decent 2 bed.

ChuckNorris89 3y ago

>It's horrific in the UK for those that don't own It's horrific everywhere if you don't own. Granted, some countries make it difficult to evict someone who isn't paying their rent, but that comes at the cost of landlords explicitly seeking to rent exclusively to people with good jobs or letting the apartment stay empty rather than risking letting someone in who might not be able to pay, with no way of evicting them.

taylodl 3y ago

American here. My wife is a property manager. All I can say is WOW!!! Here in the States, and we're backward on many issues as you're surely well aware, renters have a lot of rights. If you sign a lease, there are very well-defined laws for eviction. It's a tedious process and it even involves engaging the county Sheriff. No kidding. There are even things as an owner you must provider renters: heat, water, heated water, no major plumbing leaks, no exposure to the elements. The renter may not pay the rent, they must put it in escrow, if these items are not being provided and you cannot evict the renter for non-payment in that case. The landlord cannot terminate the lease because they can make more money doing something else. They investigate "slumlords" pretty rigorously, especially given the real estate market we're seeing today. I'm honestly surprised to hear the UK doesn't have all these sorts of protections in place for renters.