3 ms·

Canadian here. No chance we have a globally competitive horse in this race. We have completed the transition to middling non-Germany European country culturally

Canadian here. No chance we have a globally competitive horse in this race. We have completed the transition to middling non-Germany European country culturally. People aspire to work 30 hours a week and have interesting hobbies, tech is scary. I say this in a value neutral way as someone based in Waterloo which appears to have almost no startups left.

opportune 3y ago
It seems very hard for Canada to grow a strong local tech industry due to the ease of immigration to the US for all the local talent that wants to be involved in tech, plus additional regulatory barriers selling to eg the US, making Canada basically less competitive than less developed US states (less regulatory barriers selling within US market, no barrier to employees going to existing tech hubs). So Canada can only rely on immigrants for these jobs, many of which are immigrating to Canada as a stepping stone to the US anyway, and which Canada seems better about actually letting them naturalize.
- 908B64B197 3y ago
  Few years ago we acquired something in Montreal related to AI, and it's interesting because when we tried to get the team to relocate to California many weren't interested. A lot of the key personel ended-up moving, but they still kept a significant presence in the city. Even today, when hiring they'll have engineers indicate early in the process they won't ever move (despite pretty much everyone considered for that office being eligible for an O-1 due to the nature of the work being done there). What's interesting is we oppened a sattelite location in Toronto and it was a completely different experience. First thing people asked coming into interviews was about relocating to the US and if we could sponsor their visa. The demographics also skewed heavily toward recent immigrants to Canada. The irony was, the Toronto location was opened specifically to house developers that simply couldn't pass the higher bar for US immigration.
  - opportune 3y ago
    That is interesting, most of my comment is motivated by exposure to the Toronto/Vancouver scenes and not Montreal. Maybe Montreal really is sufficiently different that my broad generalizations don’t apply. I have worked with some Montreal based developers before who I think would never consider the US because they were native French speakers and preferred that in their day-to-day. Curious if there are other major factors
    - 908B64B197 3y ago
      > because they were native French speakers and preferred that in their day-to-day. That's what I assumed as well (lack of familiarity with the language or perceived bad language skills) until I realized that someone who I had assumed was a native English speaker was actually a native French speaker.
      - version_five 3y ago
        It would be tough to find an educated Quebecer that wasn't bilingual, though some may not want to speak English at work. I don't think language is a big issue overall though. Outside Toronto (maybe Vancouver too, I'm not familiar) many people are happy with their quality of life, family nearby, etc and are not motivated to move. Those that want to be elsewhere have already gone. Certainly in the maritimes and western provinces there are lots of people that feel at home and would only leave if they got really desperate. Toronto I think has a lot more people that tolerate it for the sake of their job, but would rather be somewhere else.
jasonwcfan 3y ago
There's a lot of snowbird founders who bounce between Toronto and the US but most of the economic value they create ends up accruing to the US. It's pretty sad

opportune 3y ago

It seems very hard for Canada to grow a strong local tech industry due to the ease of immigration to the US for all the local talent that wants to be involved in tech, plus additional regulatory barriers selling to eg the US, making Canada basically less competitive than less developed US states (less regulatory barriers selling within US market, no barrier to employees going to existing tech hubs). So Canada can only rely on immigrants for these jobs, many of which are immigrating to Canada as a stepping stone to the US anyway, and which Canada seems better about actually letting them naturalize.

908B64B197 3y ago
Few years ago we acquired something in Montreal related to AI, and it's interesting because when we tried to get the team to relocate to California many weren't interested. A lot of the key personel ended-up moving, but they still kept a significant presence in the city. Even today, when hiring they'll have engineers indicate early in the process they won't ever move (despite pretty much everyone considered for that office being eligible for an O-1 due to the nature of the work being done there). What's interesting is we oppened a sattelite location in Toronto and it was a completely different experience. First thing people asked coming into interviews was about relocating to the US and if we could sponsor their visa. The demographics also skewed heavily toward recent immigrants to Canada. The irony was, the Toronto location was opened specifically to house developers that simply couldn't pass the higher bar for US immigration.
- opportune 3y ago
  That is interesting, most of my comment is motivated by exposure to the Toronto/Vancouver scenes and not Montreal. Maybe Montreal really is sufficiently different that my broad generalizations don’t apply. I have worked with some Montreal based developers before who I think would never consider the US because they were native French speakers and preferred that in their day-to-day. Curious if there are other major factors
  - 908B64B197 3y ago
    > because they were native French speakers and preferred that in their day-to-day. That's what I assumed as well (lack of familiarity with the language or perceived bad language skills) until I realized that someone who I had assumed was a native English speaker was actually a native French speaker.
    - version_five 3y ago
      It would be tough to find an educated Quebecer that wasn't bilingual, though some may not want to speak English at work. I don't think language is a big issue overall though. Outside Toronto (maybe Vancouver too, I'm not familiar) many people are happy with their quality of life, family nearby, etc and are not motivated to move. Those that want to be elsewhere have already gone. Certainly in the maritimes and western provinces there are lots of people that feel at home and would only leave if they got really desperate. Toronto I think has a lot more people that tolerate it for the sake of their job, but would rather be somewhere else.

jasonwcfan 3y ago

There's a lot of snowbird founders who bounce between Toronto and the US but most of the economic value they create ends up accruing to the US. It's pretty sad