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> Companies are relocating out of China for cost and for political risk of further US decoupling. Also concerns over IP theft. And furthermore, I don't think

> Companies are relocating out of China for cost and for political risk of further US decoupling. Also concerns over IP theft. And furthermore, I don't think American businesses have caught up to thinking this way, but they've really lost the ability to think like people who design and make products nowadays. Quality assurance on even formerly trusted brands has dramatically eroded. They all fall back on efficient logistics and cheap returns to make up for it, but that's a big hidden cost in time and effort from the consumer. The whole consumer products industry needs to rediscover how to make good stuff. I think there will also be a decent bit of training the consumer to accept things costing a few extra bucks instead of impulse buying with the assumption they can easily return it (but will never get around to returning).

jpgvm 3y ago
One persons IP theft is another persons democratisation of technology. Chinese Shanzhai culture is actually crazy interesting and full of insane reverse engineering efforts etc. Some of my best memories in Shenzen are talking with local EEs about how they RE all sorts of chips and circuits and not only produce good copies but usually more efficient/cost optimized. As for Chinese quality, you get what you pay for - not much different to the rest of the world. There are design firms and factories in China that make absolutely stellar products with insane fit and finish. However there is tons across the whole quality spectrum with plenty catering to the low end of folks doing pure export products that are destined for those cheap $2 stores etc.
- naravara 3y ago
  > you get what you pay for No amount of money will make up for the erosion of manufacturing expertise and deprioritization of the perspectives of people who actually know how to make stuff being involved in corporate strategy and staffing. They can't pay for good because they don't even know how to enforce goodness. Apple does, and they get great results. Other storied brands do not.
- mensetmanusman 3y ago
  Unpolished IP theft just makes it illogical for anyone to invest in R&D. It's a type of tragedy of the commons.

jpgvm 3y ago

One persons IP theft is another persons democratisation of technology. Chinese Shanzhai culture is actually crazy interesting and full of insane reverse engineering efforts etc. Some of my best memories in Shenzen are talking with local EEs about how they RE all sorts of chips and circuits and not only produce good copies but usually more efficient/cost optimized. As for Chinese quality, you get what you pay for - not much different to the rest of the world. There are design firms and factories in China that make absolutely stellar products with insane fit and finish. However there is tons across the whole quality spectrum with plenty catering to the low end of folks doing pure export products that are destined for those cheap $2 stores etc.

naravara 3y ago
> you get what you pay for No amount of money will make up for the erosion of manufacturing expertise and deprioritization of the perspectives of people who actually know how to make stuff being involved in corporate strategy and staffing. They can't pay for good because they don't even know how to enforce goodness. Apple does, and they get great results. Other storied brands do not.
mensetmanusman 3y ago
Unpolished IP theft just makes it illogical for anyone to invest in R&D. It's a type of tragedy of the commons.