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70% of the planet is filled with salted water, which are thriving ecosystems. Is there any reason I'm missing why expanding the ocean won't just give us more o

70% of the planet is filled with salted water, which are thriving ecosystems. Is there any reason I'm missing why expanding the ocean won't just give us more ocean?

alex_duf 3y ago
That's a fair point, I only had a land ecosystem in mind when writing it, sure there would probably be plenty of sea life in there.
bradleyjg 3y ago
I think most of the oceans are a barren wasteland. That said, as a shallow and, at least at first, nutrient rich part of the ocean it could be a flourishing part of it. But if it’s filled via underground pipe, it’ll be isolated from sources of ocean life.
- zaphar 3y ago
  I think most of the oceans are a barren wasteland. This is as far as I know, incorrect. I'm not sure why you think it would be true. Oceans, aside from areas like the Dead Sea are some of the most vibrant and life filled ecosystems we have. Even at the most crushing depths far from the sun there are entire ecosystems on the ocean floor.
  - bradleyjg 3y ago
    From articles like this one: https://edu.rsc.org/feature/iron-ocean-seeding/2020176.article https://edu.rsc.org/feature/iron-ocean-seeding/2020176.artic... Could be wrong.
  - black_puppydog 3y ago
    But as you say: except for the dead sea. In my mind, these new seas would have a steady influx of salt water, but only sweet water would evaporate out of them. And since I don't see the mechanism by which salt would get sequestered or removed from these bassins, I'd also guest their salt concentration would rise quite quickly. Of course, it might still be interesting to have a huge water surface in the area that effectively serves as a rain generator, but it might not be the same thriving ecosystem we imagine when we say "ocean".
  - BurningFrog 3y ago
    The Dead Sea is a lake, which is why it's dead.
  - akiselev 3y ago
    The GP is technically correct. By volume much of the ocean is practically a wasteland because of the oxygen minimum zone [1]. A few animals like vampire squid are adapted to this zone but for the most part, the vast majority of ocean life is found in the top and bottom most layers. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_minimum_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_minimum_zone
coryfklein 3y ago
Depends on whether the rate of salt extraction is precisely equal to the inflow over the long term. The Great Salt Lake is extremely salty and basically only two species can live in it: brine shrimp and brine flies. With about the corresponding level of "tourism" you'd expect. And that is with industrial levels of salt harvesting. Would we expect the salt harvesting of these inland seas to be equal to or greater than the daily inflow of salt via the sea water? Seems dubious to me. On the other hand, there are still many other benefits. Migratory birds love the Great Salt Lake. The Great Salt Lake Effect[0] on precipitation in this desert seems unambiguously positive. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Salt_Lake_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Salt_Lake_effect
- BurningFrog 3y ago
  If you make it a bay of the Mediterranean, it should behave no differently than the rest of that ocean. With the various pipeline/tunnel/channel options that are admittedly more realistic, at least at first, there might very well be the kind of problems you mention.
- ignite 3y ago
  > there are still many other benefits. Too bad it's going away. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jan/10/utah-great-salt-lake-collapse-imminent https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jan/10/utah-gre...
- Gordonjcp 3y ago
  > Migratory birds love the Great Salt Lake some birds, flying: "hey you want to come and eat some shrimp?" "yeah I could go for some shrimp, know anywhere good?" "well yes actually, but it's a bit of a trek" "okay cool, sky trip!"
cryptonector 3y ago
Filling basins with ocean water will not increase the volume of sea water. It will probably increase the area of sea water (thus increasing evaporation, causing more precipitation, and speeding up the water cycle, which has a net cooling effect on the planet), and it will lower sea levels. Win win win win!
- mecsred 3y ago
  You're underestimating just how big the oceans are.

70% of the planet is filled with salted water, which are thriving ecosystems. Is there any reason I'm missing why expanding the ocean won't just give us more ocean?

alex_duf 3y ago

That's a fair point, I only had a land ecosystem in mind when writing it, sure there would probably be plenty of sea life in there.

bradleyjg 3y ago

I think most of the oceans are a barren wasteland. That said, as a shallow and, at least at first, nutrient rich part of the ocean it could be a flourishing part of it. But if it’s filled via underground pipe, it’ll be isolated from sources of ocean life.

zaphar 3y ago
I think most of the oceans are a barren wasteland. This is as far as I know, incorrect. I'm not sure why you think it would be true. Oceans, aside from areas like the Dead Sea are some of the most vibrant and life filled ecosystems we have. Even at the most crushing depths far from the sun there are entire ecosystems on the ocean floor.
- bradleyjg 3y ago
  From articles like this one: https://edu.rsc.org/feature/iron-ocean-seeding/2020176.article https://edu.rsc.org/feature/iron-ocean-seeding/2020176.artic... Could be wrong.
- black_puppydog 3y ago
  But as you say: except for the dead sea. In my mind, these new seas would have a steady influx of salt water, but only sweet water would evaporate out of them. And since I don't see the mechanism by which salt would get sequestered or removed from these bassins, I'd also guest their salt concentration would rise quite quickly. Of course, it might still be interesting to have a huge water surface in the area that effectively serves as a rain generator, but it might not be the same thriving ecosystem we imagine when we say "ocean".
- BurningFrog 3y ago
  The Dead Sea is a lake, which is why it's dead.
- akiselev 3y ago
  The GP is technically correct. By volume much of the ocean is practically a wasteland because of the oxygen minimum zone [1]. A few animals like vampire squid are adapted to this zone but for the most part, the vast majority of ocean life is found in the top and bottom most layers. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_minimum_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_minimum_zone

coryfklein 3y ago

Depends on whether the rate of salt extraction is precisely equal to the inflow over the long term. The Great Salt Lake is extremely salty and basically only two species can live in it: brine shrimp and brine flies. With about the corresponding level of "tourism" you'd expect. And that is with industrial levels of salt harvesting. Would we expect the salt harvesting of these inland seas to be equal to or greater than the daily inflow of salt via the sea water? Seems dubious to me. On the other hand, there are still many other benefits. Migratory birds love the Great Salt Lake. The Great Salt Lake Effect[0] on precipitation in this desert seems unambiguously positive. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Salt_Lake_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Salt_Lake_effect

BurningFrog 3y ago
If you make it a bay of the Mediterranean, it should behave no differently than the rest of that ocean. With the various pipeline/tunnel/channel options that are admittedly more realistic, at least at first, there might very well be the kind of problems you mention.
ignite 3y ago
> there are still many other benefits. Too bad it's going away. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jan/10/utah-great-salt-lake-collapse-imminent https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jan/10/utah-gre...
Gordonjcp 3y ago
> Migratory birds love the Great Salt Lake some birds, flying: "hey you want to come and eat some shrimp?" "yeah I could go for some shrimp, know anywhere good?" "well yes actually, but it's a bit of a trek" "okay cool, sky trip!"

cryptonector 3y ago

Filling basins with ocean water will not increase the volume of sea water. It will probably increase the area of sea water (thus increasing evaporation, causing more precipitation, and speeding up the water cycle, which has a net cooling effect on the planet), and it will lower sea levels. Win win win win!

mecsred 3y ago
You're underestimating just how big the oceans are.