4 ms·
Probably a lot fewer upstarts find success than you imagine - it may seem like "a lot" but the rate of success is abysmal. It's hard to get accurate statistics
by ido 3y ago
Probably a lot fewer upstarts find success than you imagine - it may seem like "a lot" but the rate of success is abysmal. It's hard to get accurate statistics because it's not obvious what to count, but from the attempts I've read it's somewhat over 90% of games that do not breakeven and has been this way since the early 90s at least (probably earlier but it's even harder to find data the further back you go).
The vast majority of startup game studios go bankrupt within a couple years of founding and the vast majority of solo indie devs only release one game.
There is no international industry-wide wage-suppression conspiracy, the supply-demand equilibrium is simply at a lower wage level than non-games tech.
It can be "unfair" in an intuitive and specific case while still being the result of market forces (is it fair that I'm paying rent to my former landlord's son? he did nothing to earn it except inherit this building)
EDIT: I realize you were not claiming it was a conspiracy, I just wanted to correct a common perspective by industry outsiders that see a lot of success stories and think "how hard can it be?" - the world is big and the "many cases" you are seeing a tiny % of the whole, which are overwhelmingly unsuccessful.
- MichaelZuo 3y agoWell in that case is it also unfair if someone, highly interested in exotic sports cars, can't afford a Ferrari on their salary?
- ido 3y agoI don’t know what point you think I was trying to make, but I don’t think it is the same one I was thinking of.
- MichaelZuo 3y ago> It can be "unfair" in an intuitive and specific case while still being the result of market forces (is it fair that I'm paying rent to my former landlord's son? he did nothing to earn it except inherit this building) It's the same market forces.
- ido 3y agoThat's why I gave it as an example. It feels unfair but that doesn't mean it's evidence of collusion/conspiracy.
- MichaelZuo 3y agoSo then your question > (is it fair that I'm paying rent to my former landlord's son? he did nothing to earn it except inherit this building) has a clear answer.
- ido 3y agoI don’t want to sound snarky but did you miss that this was a rhetorical question meant to illustrate my actual point as part of a much longer post?
- MichaelZuo 3y agoI was addressing the comment: > I don’t know what point you think I was trying to make, but I don’t think it is the same one I was thinking of.
- bloppe 3y agoIs it fair that you're paying rent to your former landlord's son? It is if the rate is fair. Being a landlord is actually a job and it can involve quite a bit of risk (property damage, housing market crashes, etc). It's not exactly rare for landlords to actually lose money. Maintenance costs, taxes, and that risk should be priced into your rent, plus a reasonable fee. If that fee is unreasonable, now you're in an unstable market state. There would have to be significant anticompetitive forces in the property market (onerous zoning, natural limitations) to keep it that way, otherwise you would want to move to a new landlord with a reasonable fee. Whether or not private inheritance is fair is a completely separate debate. We could do away with private inheritance, and all these market forces would still work to keep prices fair.
- ido 3y agoOh, absolutely the failing is actually of the city to get enough housing built as to create an efficient market. But my point wasn’t really about my landlord but that the fact that some executive at Ubisoft or Activision are paying themselves generously while paying employees worse than non-games tech isn’t an indication that the lower wages in the games industry are due to collusion, rather than supply/demand equilibria being different in different sub-industries.