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Just off the top, I'm seeing a common logical misfire here, specifically: > If you asked the average American on the street about tech, they would tell you the

by Zetice 3y ago

Just off the top, I'm seeing a common logical misfire here, specifically: > If you asked the average American on the street about tech, they would tell you they like to use products like Airbnb, DoorDash, Uber, Facebook, Amazon, and many other supposedly maligned companies. It's actually a bit of a giveaway when you say "on the street". Most Americans aren't on the street at all. I dunno what the quality of this source is, but I found that Doordash delivers to 20 million consumers in a given month[0], which if true, accounts for 6% of Americans! 94% of Americans do not "like to use" Doordash. Even Uber, which according to the same random well-SEO'd source, has 93 million monthly platform consumers[1], which means only 28% of Americans use Uber. I'm not sure if there's really a larger point to make here, or if I'm just quibbling with terminology, but it's a giant mistake to presume "most Americans" do nearly anything. [0] https://backlinko.com/doordash-users https://backlinko.com/doordash-users [1] https://backlinko.com/uber-users https://backlinko.com/uber-users

boondoggle16 3y ago
Bubbles are super common, and even more common on the internet. I find this phenomenon fascinating. For example, there are many people on HN who absolutely cannot comprehend why people prefer single family housing, with a yard, and a car. So much so, that I've considered writing an article from my perspective, about why I prefer low-density housing. The ratio of commenters to lurkers is super low, and (speaking from experience), commenters often have mental problems, which drives them to post excessively. The vast majority of Americans are absolutely nothing like the drivel we read online. I waffle between thinking this is caused by "terminally online" folks like myself, and bots aka astro-turfed corporatism. Either way, the opinions we read online do not reflect reality. Historians will have a hoot interpreting our society and describing it from the perspective of the Huffington Post and Wall Street Journal.
- hughesjj 3y ago
  > For example, there are many people on HN who absolutely cannot comprehend why people prefer single family housing, with a yard, and a car. So much so, that I've considered writing an article from my perspective, about why I prefer low-density housing. Personally, I've never seen a lack of understanding for the desire of SFHs, but rather the factual realization that SFH housing is not an economically sustainable path for the majority of Americans and the world.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- BirdieNZ 3y ago
  Who are these people who can't comprehend SFH car preferences? I'm pretty pro-urban-density and pro-transit/walking/cycling, but I definitely understand why people prefer SFH and cars and low density. Heck, I don't think we should ban any of those, we should just allow people to build denser if they want to and spend as much on mass transit and cycling and walking as we do on cars.
  - boondoggle16 3y ago
    Not sure what to tell ya, but if you read thousands of HN comments under housing articles like I do, they are out there.
Hermitian909 3y ago
> Even Uber, which according to the same random well-SEO'd source, has 93 million monthly platform consumers[1], which means only 28% of Americans use Uber. Looking at month to month stats like this seems like a poor proxy for "likeable". Something like Uber tends to have a core set of heavy users with a long tail of more infrequent users. I and most people I know use Uber every few months and often in spurts e.g. I travel a few times a year and don't rent a car at my destination. My uber use spikes during this time but is otherwise close to zero. Similarly, some people seem take a "uber in an emergency approach" to the service. This is something I certainly appreciate about the service as well. None of this actually tells us how "liked" the service is though.
- ghaff 3y ago
  My usage probably breaks into use it pretty much daily or at least close, use it/consider using it in spurts, and basically never use it. I suspect my never use it (or at least once in a blue moon) bucket would make me seem like an alien in some demographics. Uber/Lyft is probably my main thing in the middle bucket. I mostly only use on fairly occasional trips by plane and not frequently even then.
- Zetice 3y ago
  For sure, but I think the point stands. 93 million is a huge number, but it's not even a third of "Americans". I don't think there's any measurement you could use that would show Uber used by even half of Americans.
deleted 3y ago
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Sprocklem 3y ago
And even those that do "like to use" those products may still take issue with those companies on moral grounds while continuing to use them, either because there is no meaningful alternative for their purposes or because the convenience overrides their moral objections.
cavisne 3y ago
The Uber example seems like a stretch. If 28% of america uses it monthly, its probably comfortably a majority when you stretch to yearly (ie airport trips). Especially if you extend it to include Lyft. Rideshare has comfortably replaced taxis, likewise Doordash + competitors have comfortably replaced the alternative (which for most of the country was pizza delivery).
- Zetice 3y ago
  I don't think you can say with any certainty at all that "comfortably a majority" of Americans use Uber, especially given that relatively paltry 28% monthly. I understand some people use Uber infrequently, but I think you'll need something more substantial than anecdote to demonstrate that moves the needle more than a percentage or two overall.

by Zetice 3y ago

boondoggle16 3y ago

Bubbles are super common, and even more common on the internet. I find this phenomenon fascinating. For example, there are many people on HN who absolutely cannot comprehend why people prefer single family housing, with a yard, and a car. So much so, that I've considered writing an article from my perspective, about why I prefer low-density housing. The ratio of commenters to lurkers is super low, and (speaking from experience), commenters often have mental problems, which drives them to post excessively. The vast majority of Americans are absolutely nothing like the drivel we read online. I waffle between thinking this is caused by "terminally online" folks like myself, and bots aka astro-turfed corporatism. Either way, the opinions we read online do not reflect reality. Historians will have a hoot interpreting our society and describing it from the perspective of the Huffington Post and Wall Street Journal.

hughesjj 3y ago
> For example, there are many people on HN who absolutely cannot comprehend why people prefer single family housing, with a yard, and a car. So much so, that I've considered writing an article from my perspective, about why I prefer low-density housing. Personally, I've never seen a lack of understanding for the desire of SFHs, but rather the factual realization that SFH housing is not an economically sustainable path for the majority of Americans and the world.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
BirdieNZ 3y ago
Who are these people who can't comprehend SFH car preferences? I'm pretty pro-urban-density and pro-transit/walking/cycling, but I definitely understand why people prefer SFH and cars and low density. Heck, I don't think we should ban any of those, we should just allow people to build denser if they want to and spend as much on mass transit and cycling and walking as we do on cars.
- boondoggle16 3y ago
  Not sure what to tell ya, but if you read thousands of HN comments under housing articles like I do, they are out there.

Hermitian909 3y ago

> Even Uber, which according to the same random well-SEO'd source, has 93 million monthly platform consumers[1], which means only 28% of Americans use Uber. Looking at month to month stats like this seems like a poor proxy for "likeable". Something like Uber tends to have a core set of heavy users with a long tail of more infrequent users. I and most people I know use Uber every few months and often in spurts e.g. I travel a few times a year and don't rent a car at my destination. My uber use spikes during this time but is otherwise close to zero. Similarly, some people seem take a "uber in an emergency approach" to the service. This is something I certainly appreciate about the service as well. None of this actually tells us how "liked" the service is though.

ghaff 3y ago
My usage probably breaks into use it pretty much daily or at least close, use it/consider using it in spurts, and basically never use it. I suspect my never use it (or at least once in a blue moon) bucket would make me seem like an alien in some demographics. Uber/Lyft is probably my main thing in the middle bucket. I mostly only use on fairly occasional trips by plane and not frequently even then.
Zetice 3y ago
For sure, but I think the point stands. 93 million is a huge number, but it's not even a third of "Americans". I don't think there's any measurement you could use that would show Uber used by even half of Americans.

deleted 3y ago

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Sprocklem 3y ago

And even those that do "like to use" those products may still take issue with those companies on moral grounds while continuing to use them, either because there is no meaningful alternative for their purposes or because the convenience overrides their moral objections.

cavisne 3y ago

The Uber example seems like a stretch. If 28% of america uses it monthly, its probably comfortably a majority when you stretch to yearly (ie airport trips). Especially if you extend it to include Lyft. Rideshare has comfortably replaced taxis, likewise Doordash + competitors have comfortably replaced the alternative (which for most of the country was pizza delivery).

Zetice 3y ago
I don't think you can say with any certainty at all that "comfortably a majority" of Americans use Uber, especially given that relatively paltry 28% monthly. I understand some people use Uber infrequently, but I think you'll need something more substantial than anecdote to demonstrate that moves the needle more than a percentage or two overall.