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> Interior images, exterior images, facial geometry, voice recordings, This is an absolutely unbelievable level of privacy intrusion IMO. I 100% support very h

> Interior images, exterior images, facial geometry, voice recordings, This is an absolutely unbelievable level of privacy intrusion IMO. I 100% support very heavily fining this sort of behavior, otherwise it will continue to proliferate.

Cardinal7167 3y ago
It will never get fined because it’s how the people who legislate fines are making (and keeping) their money and control.
- mulmen 3y ago
  That's not how democracy works. Apathy is toxic. Please stop hurting us.
  - LamaOfRuin 3y ago
    Cynicism is not apathy. If they were apathetic, they would have no reason to comment.
  - int_19h 3y ago
    The way "representative democracy" (in quotes because both words are a lie) works at scale of any large country is as follows: you elect people based on simplistic promises that they make, and if they win and you're lucky, they kinda sorta do something that's vaguely like half of what they promised. Your only recourse is waiting for N years to vote for someone else who will almost certainly do the same thing. Not only is this all by design, but in many countries, the "free mandate" - i.e. the notion that the politician can say A before the election and then do ~A after - is even legally codified. In theory, this is supposed to allow the elected representatives to apply their own judgment based on nuances of the moment instead of pandering to the mob. In practice, it means that your representative is free to pander to people other than those they "represent" while still claiming a public mandate based on the votes received.
    - smeej 3y ago
      Not only this, but most people don't actually like the vague promises of the candidate they voted for. They're just praying that one will be moderately less terrible than the alternative. There's never an option to say, "No, none of these power-hungry psychos should get to make this set of decisions on my behalf."
    - mulmen 3y ago
      This is a bad take. Representative democracy works and we have plenty of examples of that happening even within our lifetimes. Your negative outlook is a choice and it’s wrong. Do better. We elect representatives at every level of government. In a country of 335,000,000 people a slow moving central government is a feature. If you really want to make a difference pay attention to your city council.
      - int_19h 3y ago
        My outlook is from experience. I used to be a believer in representative democracy, but I simply cannot reconcile that with observations anymore. Note, by the way, that I'm not claiming that changes don't happen in this system. What I'm saying is that changes happen when the ruling class is convinced it's time for them, not when the populace as a whole is - and no amount of voting changes that. The fewer people each representative represents, the closer it is to an actual democracy, which is why city councils etc generally work better (although they are still far from ideal and have the same fundamental problems I described). But the nature of modern politics weaves local issues into broader ones on higher levels, and what ought to be local politics increasingly becomes national.
        mulmen 3y ago
        I honestly can’t even follow this. So you agree democracy works but it’s bad for… reasons? Can you be more specific? You have “experience” but you can’t articulate it. Sounds like you’re just jaded. That’s not democracy’s fault.
        3y ago
- jacquesm 3y ago
  EU DPA's may have something to say about this if EU data subjects data was leaked.
plagiarist 3y ago
We need stronger laws about protecting user data. Like HIPAA but for everything. Storing millions of hours of video of people driving and their GPS should be a liability. I did not consent to any of this, but I'm certainly on recordings for drivers who did, that should also be an enormous fine.
- 93po 3y ago
  we need politicians that do literally anything other than serve capitalism at all costs
version_five 3y ago
Where would the support for fines come from? When government understands these issues at all, they only want more control and restriction. The only thing I can imagine legislators getting upset about is they the car manufacturers are not sharing all the info with government by default. Next steps will be mandating tracking, not fining for it.
- LinuxBender 3y ago
  Where would the support for fines come from? Probably when a legislators private graphic videos with an escort or drug dealer or something more interesting gets leaked. Perhaps some government officials data is present in the leak as we speak. It might be harder to spot if not a personally owned vehicle or still cloud registered to a previous owner.
  - Mountain_Skies 3y ago
    That's how video rental records became private when Supreme Court justice nominee Robert Bork's records were leaked and suddenly everyone in Congress panicked that it could someday happen to them. Bork turned out to have mundane tastes in movies but obviously members of Congress were renting movies a bit more wild.
    - galangalalgol 3y ago
      Is the movie list still around? That might make for a fun watch list.
- feanaro 3y ago
  Well, try not being so passive. Are you living in an unchangeable authoritarian system?
  - smeej 3y ago
    Yes? When was the last time people were satisfied with the candidates available to "represent" them and were doing anything other than choosing the "lesser of two evils" to try to keep it from getting worse?
michaelmior 3y ago
When you look at the specific uses, I think it's a bit less unbelievable. I think the important piece is that they should more clearly stipulate how the data is used and what controls are in place to protect it. Even more importantly, opt out by default if there's any chance of the data leaving your vehicle and a clear mechanism for wiping all collected data. > Your Facial Geometric Features will only be stored on your vehicle. > Vehicles equipped with Teammate use sensor and/or image data from the vehicle’s interior and exterior to evaluate the vehicle’s surroundings
smeej 3y ago
Voice recording without explicit consent of all recorded parties is illegal under wiretapping laws in my state, and my state is pretty aggressive about it. I wonder how that factors into this.
- mixmastamyk 3y ago
  Regulators may not have realized. Maybe send an anonymous tip.

Cardinal7167 3y ago

It will never get fined because it’s how the people who legislate fines are making (and keeping) their money and control.

mulmen 3y ago
That's not how democracy works. Apathy is toxic. Please stop hurting us.
- LamaOfRuin 3y ago
  Cynicism is not apathy. If they were apathetic, they would have no reason to comment.
- int_19h 3y ago
  The way "representative democracy" (in quotes because both words are a lie) works at scale of any large country is as follows: you elect people based on simplistic promises that they make, and if they win and you're lucky, they kinda sorta do something that's vaguely like half of what they promised. Your only recourse is waiting for N years to vote for someone else who will almost certainly do the same thing. Not only is this all by design, but in many countries, the "free mandate" - i.e. the notion that the politician can say A before the election and then do ~A after - is even legally codified. In theory, this is supposed to allow the elected representatives to apply their own judgment based on nuances of the moment instead of pandering to the mob. In practice, it means that your representative is free to pander to people other than those they "represent" while still claiming a public mandate based on the votes received.
  - smeej 3y ago
    Not only this, but most people don't actually like the vague promises of the candidate they voted for. They're just praying that one will be moderately less terrible than the alternative. There's never an option to say, "No, none of these power-hungry psychos should get to make this set of decisions on my behalf."
  - mulmen 3y ago
    This is a bad take. Representative democracy works and we have plenty of examples of that happening even within our lifetimes. Your negative outlook is a choice and it’s wrong. Do better. We elect representatives at every level of government. In a country of 335,000,000 people a slow moving central government is a feature. If you really want to make a difference pay attention to your city council.
    - int_19h 3y ago
      My outlook is from experience. I used to be a believer in representative democracy, but I simply cannot reconcile that with observations anymore. Note, by the way, that I'm not claiming that changes don't happen in this system. What I'm saying is that changes happen when the ruling class is convinced it's time for them, not when the populace as a whole is - and no amount of voting changes that. The fewer people each representative represents, the closer it is to an actual democracy, which is why city councils etc generally work better (although they are still far from ideal and have the same fundamental problems I described). But the nature of modern politics weaves local issues into broader ones on higher levels, and what ought to be local politics increasingly becomes national.
      - mulmen 3y ago
        I honestly can’t even follow this. So you agree democracy works but it’s bad for… reasons? Can you be more specific? You have “experience” but you can’t articulate it. Sounds like you’re just jaded. That’s not democracy’s fault.
        3y ago
jacquesm 3y ago
EU DPA's may have something to say about this if EU data subjects data was leaked.

plagiarist 3y ago

We need stronger laws about protecting user data. Like HIPAA but for everything. Storing millions of hours of video of people driving and their GPS should be a liability. I did not consent to any of this, but I'm certainly on recordings for drivers who did, that should also be an enormous fine.

93po 3y ago
we need politicians that do literally anything other than serve capitalism at all costs

version_five 3y ago

Where would the support for fines come from? When government understands these issues at all, they only want more control and restriction. The only thing I can imagine legislators getting upset about is they the car manufacturers are not sharing all the info with government by default. Next steps will be mandating tracking, not fining for it.

LinuxBender 3y ago
Where would the support for fines come from? Probably when a legislators private graphic videos with an escort or drug dealer or something more interesting gets leaked. Perhaps some government officials data is present in the leak as we speak. It might be harder to spot if not a personally owned vehicle or still cloud registered to a previous owner.
- Mountain_Skies 3y ago
  That's how video rental records became private when Supreme Court justice nominee Robert Bork's records were leaked and suddenly everyone in Congress panicked that it could someday happen to them. Bork turned out to have mundane tastes in movies but obviously members of Congress were renting movies a bit more wild.
  - galangalalgol 3y ago
    Is the movie list still around? That might make for a fun watch list.
feanaro 3y ago
Well, try not being so passive. Are you living in an unchangeable authoritarian system?
- smeej 3y ago
  Yes? When was the last time people were satisfied with the candidates available to "represent" them and were doing anything other than choosing the "lesser of two evils" to try to keep it from getting worse?

michaelmior 3y ago

When you look at the specific uses, I think it's a bit less unbelievable. I think the important piece is that they should more clearly stipulate how the data is used and what controls are in place to protect it. Even more importantly, opt out by default if there's any chance of the data leaving your vehicle and a clear mechanism for wiping all collected data. > Your Facial Geometric Features will only be stored on your vehicle. > Vehicles equipped with Teammate use sensor and/or image data from the vehicle’s interior and exterior to evaluate the vehicle’s surroundings

smeej 3y ago

Voice recording without explicit consent of all recorded parties is illegal under wiretapping laws in my state, and my state is pretty aggressive about it. I wonder how that factors into this.

mixmastamyk 3y ago
Regulators may not have realized. Maybe send an anonymous tip.