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Show HN: The Leica MPi: A Leica M2 with a Raspberry Pi-Powered Digital Sensor
PetaPixel article: https://petapixel.com/2023/05/11/the-post-digital-leica-mpi-a-leica-m2-with-a-raspberry-pi-camera/ https://petapixel.com/2023/05/11/the-post-digital-leica-mpi-...
- ggm 3y agoIt would have been nice if some of the example photos were less post produced, and had the kind of reference image quality dpreview used to use, so we can see how leica compatible lenses and the 12megapixel CCD interact. It's significantly smaller than a 35mm film area, it should avoid some of the lens edge spherical abberation and coma issues but also has less light falling on it maybe. It looked to be fixed shutter speed variable aperture? Tying it to the flash trigger event was smart, if I recall correctly flash tended to fixed shutter speed for logical reasons. Great project. I loved how it was non destructive.
- inetsee 3y agoI really liked this article until I went out and looked at how much Leica M2s cost. The project may only cost $100 in Raspberry Pi parts, but it looks like acquiring a Leica M2 can cost thousands of dollars.
- et-al 3y agoTheoretically you could adapt this for less expensive rangefinders like a Canonet QL17. M4-2s are also less desirable.
- gerikson 3y agoHe also used as 12mm lens to compensate a little for the 5.5x crop factor, and the one he used costs around $400 used. It's also really slow at f/5.6.
- kybernetyk 3y agoYou can always take the soviet rip-offs like the Zorki 4 [0]. Price is around $50 (at lest the last time I checked). I have one (it was my first cam gifted to me back in the 1980s by my father) and it still works very well. Though I nowadays tend to adapt the Jupiter 8 lens I got on it to my Nikon Z6. :) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zorki_4 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zorki_4
- numpad0 3y agoZorki cameras are Leica II/III(aka D2/D3) clones with LSM/L39 mounts, which don't take later M-mount lenses, though M series bodies(M3-M7) takes LSM via an adapter. Also they're not real Leica in case you care.
- kybernetyk 3y ago>Also they're not real Leica in case you care. I dont :)
- vr46 3y agoIndeed - that made me laugh. I've a single ZM lens left over after I sold my M9 and I'd really like to get it back to active duty. The price of ANY M-mount camer body is excruciating. I really liked the project info regarding shutter speeds etc, and I'm considering trying this out with a Nikon FE2 I don't really like and picked up for £100 some years ago, but I suspect even these cameras have gone up in price. I might make another pinhole camera for the RPI sensor, that can be done with an old body cap and any camera-like box.
- jasomill 3y agoSpeaking of Nikon, the Nikon F2, a fantastic, fully mechanical[1] SLR, is widely available on the used market for <$500 and compatible with nearly every full-frame Nikon SLR lens ever made with an aperture ring[2]. My current personal favorite "vintage" camera is an F2 with non-metering prism, type H full-field microprism viewing screen, and 50mm f/1.2 lens (still a current[3] Nikon product!), mostly because it has the clearest, brightest, largest viewfinder image I've ever seen on a 35mm camera. [1] Other than flashes and optional electronic metering prisms. [2] The only exceptions I'm aware of are the PC-E tilt/shift lenses, which have "soft" physical aperture rings that still require electronics, and therefore power supplied via the lens mount, to actually stop down the lens. Also, my claim only fully applies to non-metering F2 viewfinders; metering prisms protrude a bit from the front of the camera body and interfere with the mounting and/or operation of certain lenses (including, I believe, all PC lenses). [3] https://www.nikonusa.com/en/Nikon-Products/Product/Camera-Lenses/NIKKOR-50mm-f%252F1.2.html https://www.nikonusa.com/en/Nikon-Products/Product/Camera-Le...
- vr46 3y agoI had an F2AS for many years, excellent viewfinder indeed, 0.8x, the same as non-HP F3, but quite a beast to carry around. The ME Super had even bigger magnification but probably not a 100% coverage screen. I only sold the F2 motor drive last year, and that was ridiculous too, ten AA batteries for the MB1 battery pack. Cannot believe I used to take that thing to parties for kicks 20-30 years ago.
- psychomugs 3y agoI got the M2 for $500 in 2017. Combined with the 12mm I bought in Japan on the weak ¥en, I had just under $1000 into the system.
- jdefelice 3y agoAs someone who is in the market for a Leica m2, the prices have skyrocketed in the past few years.
- dylan604 3y agoSeeing the word Leica should have immediately set off the "oh shit, that'll be expensive" alarms
- Clamchop 3y agoI've daydreamt before of a device, sensor attached by thin film ribbon cable to a faux film canister holding the computery bits. A general fit solution to film camera conversion. But, sensor thickness and power source may be intractable problems. Cool project!
- nine_k 3y agoI even think this has been tried. The canister version is indeed unworkable, but changing the whole back part into a digital adapter was done multiple times. See e.g. https://casualphotophile.com/2022/05/19/digi-swap-im-back-re35-digital-film/ https://casualphotophile.com/2022/05/19/digi-swap-im-back-re...
- numpad0 3y agoOne of issues I read somewhere is that distance between film-patrone to imaging area is not standardized, and also what I figured is digital sensors needs spaces to the back of focal plane which film cameras cannot accomodate. This is apparent just from comparing digital continuations of film camera brands.
- nibbleshifter 3y agoThat filter he removed is the IR cut, I believe. Not an anti aliasing filter. The magenta hue you see in the outdoor shots is characteristic of photos taken using a sensor with no IR blocking filter (also known as a hot mirror).
- psychomugs 3y agoThanks, I felt like the term I was using was wrong.
- nibbleshifter 3y agoHow much effort was it to remove from the sensor? I've modified a number of cameras to remove that filter specifically for IR photography
- psychomugs 3y agoAs simple as grabbing it off with tweezers.
- morcheeba 3y agoYou can probably replace this with a threaded IR cut filter that screws on to your lens.
- raihansaputra 3y agoLove this. Due to the rising costs of film lots of people are switching to older, CCD sensor digital pocket/prosumer cameras. They produce great photos in good lighting (ISO200-400, like film). The sensor quality and "raw" image is good, but they're held back by the old processing hardware. I wish it's easier to hack these older sensors to newer boards/hardware for better control/output. Even an ESP32 would be an upgrade to the older processing boards I guess.
- schrijver 3y agoThere are options atm… just not on-device. There’s CHDK, https://chdk.fandom.com/wiki/CHDK https://chdk.fandom.com/wiki/CHDK which changes the firmware of certain Canon compact cameras to add (among other things) RAW output. It should help you get the max out of your sensor. Then again, the first generation of pocketable mirrorless cameras with APS-C sized sensors (which are much bigger & high quality than those found in pocket cameras, or the one used in the article’s hack) should be pretty accessible right now… ie Fuji x-t10, canon m1/2/3. The Canon M1 also takes Magic Lantern which adds raw video ! (Albeit with a significant crop factor).
- raihansaputra 3y agoI knew about Magic Lantern but just found out about CHDK! I'll definitely try to grab a S95 to use with it. Yeah the APS-C cameras definitely has better sensors (even accounting for the better highlight falloff from the older CCD sensors), but personally the appeal of digicams is to replace my small pocket film cameras, so those are just slightly too big. (I do still have an original x100 kicking around too.)
- psychomugs 3y agoBehind my phone, the Fuji XF10 - their answer to Ricoh's GR - is probably my most-used camera out of a cabal that includes the X100V, X-T3, and X-Pro2. It's a shame that this pocket of pocketable cameras with physical controls is dying out.
- jeswin 3y agoThis is a somewhat overcrowded area of experimentation. In fact there's even an article written about it - "Stop Trying To Turn Film Cameras Into Digital Cameras" [1] The real problem is that sensors available to hobbyists are quite low-end. They can just make bad digital pics; losing both the magic of film and the fidelity of digital. Old film lenses are only usable if you get a crop factor of 2x (m4/3 size) or less, so that you can use a 40mm (as found in many inexpensive rangefinders such as the Electro 35) as an 80mm - not great for typical use but usable. I am actually quite surprised why in all these years, no one has made somewhat affordable ($100-400) larger sensors available for the hobbyist market. Given that there are a couple of small Chinese manufacturers making m4/3 bodies, it's surprising that no one is servicing this small (but not necessarily unviable) market. More likely is the availability of a 1" sensor at a much lower cost since ~1" sensors have started appearing on phones. That'd make a wide 24mm lens a 65mm normal lens. That would be on the far end of usable, but anything smaller is just a stale experiment for the wider audience. But of course - any experiment can be quite rewarding for whoever is doing it. [1]: https://casualphotophile.com/2022/05/19/digi-swap-im-back-re35-digital-film/ https://casualphotophile.com/2022/05/19/digi-swap-im-back-re...
- bravura 3y agoCan someone explain in detail how the hybridization of analog and digital occurs? Where and why? I, for example, would love to mod a Hasselblad medium format cameras so that it could digitally adjust light etc so I could use it as a point and shoot, but with beautiful quality output. But your linked output discusses getting worse quality photos through the addition of digital sensors. Why?
- RobotToaster 3y agoYou shoot medium format because it makes better images, because the "sensor" is bigger than 35mm. Imagine running 110 film through a hassy, it would look crap, and only capture a tiny window of what you normally do, because the "sensor" is tiny. That's basically the problem, the sensor size of hobbyist camera modules is tiny, even smaller than 110 film. They do make medium format digital backs, but they are expensive, even by hasselblad standards.
- hypertexthero 3y agoBeautiful project, and beautiful photographs! I’m glad about the plan to open source it, and hope an M3 version comes along, too.
- psychomugs 3y agoThanks! I imagine this would drop in unmodified on the M3, which may actually yield a nicer experience thanks to the the increased magnification of the viewfinder compared to the M2.
- glitchc 3y agoAn old DSLR is probably about the same price when time and effort are factored in. Why not just buy one?
- KaiserPro 3y agoSLRs are a magnitude bigger. The only thing that leicas have is that they are small range finders. Almost everything else is hype or just expense. Even compared to other film cameras at the end of the film era (90s) Granted there are some specialist 1f< lenses that are interesting, but not at that price. A recent fujifilm X digital rangefinder will probably beat the pants off a leica. But. The point of a hobby is not saving money, the point of a hobby is to enjoy doing what you are doing, even if to all the world it's patent nonsense.
- psychomugs 3y ago"The idea of opportunity costs presumes the fungibility of human experience: all our activities are equivalent or interchangeable once they are reduced to the abstract currency of clock time, and its wage correlate. But, against the ever-expanding imperium of economics, we do well to insist on what we know firsthand, namely, the concrete heterogeneity of human experience - its apples-versus-oranges character. From an economistic mind-set, spiritedness or pridefulness appears as a failure to be properly calculative, which requires that one first be properly abstract. Economics recognizes only certain virtues, and not the most impressive ones at that. Spiritedness is an assertion of one's own dignity, and to fix one's own car is not merely to use up time, it is to have a different experience of time, of one's car, and of oneself." - Matthew B. Crawford, Shop Class as Soulcraft