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Every good ideology needs a "Big Other" which subsumes all ordinary moral concerns. How could you think about something so trivial as the atrocity you see befor

Every good ideology needs a "Big Other" which subsumes all ordinary moral concerns. How could you think about something so trivial as the atrocity you see before your eyes when wealth formation/history itself/divine will/trillions of future human lives are at stake?

jjoonathan 3y ago
Big Ideas also inspire hope. Most people seem to be able to engage with them for this purpose without becoming evil. Yes, they also get abused for rationalization, but I'd caution against throwing babies out with the bathwater.
ETH_start 3y ago
Just my 2 cents: A philosophy differs from an ideology. Long-termism is a philosophy, meaning an abstract framework that is used an intellectual aid. An ideology, on the otherhand, is an all-encompassing world view, that inserts itself at the top of one's value hierarchy, and allows one to do as you describe: define any wrong as a necessary evil to fulfil the greater good. The reason long-termism is merely a philosophy, and will remain so, is that it doesn't provide a narrative that lends itself to ideological zealotry. Ideological narratives are simplistic models of the world that can be easily digested, and provide a ready litmus test to categorize any person into one of three groups: victims, villains, or saviors.
- ahelwer 3y ago
  The truest mark of an ideology is that its adherents don't even think they're being ideological, just reasonable.
  - ETH_start 3y ago
    Everyone thinks they're being reasonable.. and just for context: I don't put much stock in long-termism, but not because I see it as a potentially dangerous ideological dogma, but because I don't see it as that useful. In my opinion, the tendency of the optimal action for short-term interests to coincide with the optimal action for long-term interests, and how much easier it is to determine the former over the latter, makes it better to focus primarily on the near future, with a less-well-defined long-term objective being used only to orient one's general direction.

jjoonathan 3y ago

Big Ideas also inspire hope. Most people seem to be able to engage with them for this purpose without becoming evil. Yes, they also get abused for rationalization, but I'd caution against throwing babies out with the bathwater.

ETH_start 3y ago

Just my 2 cents: A philosophy differs from an ideology. Long-termism is a philosophy, meaning an abstract framework that is used an intellectual aid. An ideology, on the otherhand, is an all-encompassing world view, that inserts itself at the top of one's value hierarchy, and allows one to do as you describe: define any wrong as a necessary evil to fulfil the greater good. The reason long-termism is merely a philosophy, and will remain so, is that it doesn't provide a narrative that lends itself to ideological zealotry. Ideological narratives are simplistic models of the world that can be easily digested, and provide a ready litmus test to categorize any person into one of three groups: victims, villains, or saviors.

ahelwer 3y ago
The truest mark of an ideology is that its adherents don't even think they're being ideological, just reasonable.
- ETH_start 3y ago
  Everyone thinks they're being reasonable.. and just for context: I don't put much stock in long-termism, but not because I see it as a potentially dangerous ideological dogma, but because I don't see it as that useful. In my opinion, the tendency of the optimal action for short-term interests to coincide with the optimal action for long-term interests, and how much easier it is to determine the former over the latter, makes it better to focus primarily on the near future, with a less-well-defined long-term objective being used only to orient one's general direction.