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So funny to see google stressing EVERYTIME that they have been using AI for years. Dude, you were seated in the pot of gold and let your organizational disfunc

So funny to see google stressing EVERYTIME that they have been using AI for years. Dude, you were seated in the pot of gold and let your organizational disfuncionality block you from really using that. And now you come trying to get the crown of AI? Catch up and them we can talk.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
I mean, Google Translate has been basically completely AI powered for 5+ years, and it's one of the most used products in the world... The majority of what you see on SERPs has been AI generated for a decade, and that's Google's main money maker. This idea that Google sucks at AI and is clearly a million miles behind is intriguing. Google is currently the company everyone loves to hate like MSFT was 5-10 years ago. THAT is a bad sign regardless if anything the people are saying has any truth to it. MSFT has been the king of enterprise software since the 80s. But around 2000, everyone and their mother was talking about how MSFT can't produce any software beside complete garbage. None of that was true. But, MSFT was in for some relatively bad times for a decade or so. I suspect the same thing is going to happen to Google just because sentiment is powerful.
- motoboi 3y ago
  You now that, I know that, everyone knows that. And yet, google stresses it everytime, like the company is anxious that people is looking for OpenAI and not google.
  - nr2x 3y ago
    Some of the key people behind translate founded OpenAI. Don’t forget it’s always been about the people, not the brand. Google was good at attracting and retaining the best and brightest. Now they aren’t.
    - eclipxe 3y ago
      Citation needed?
      - nr2x 3y ago
        Ask and ye shall receive: “Based in part on his work with Hinton, Sutskever was hired by Google. There, he implemented a neural-network-driven approach to language translation that produced fewer errors than competing efforts. His work provided the basis for a major upgrade to Google Translate. “Researchers didn’t believe that neural networks could do translation, so it was a big surprise when they could,” he says.” https://magazine.utoronto.ca/people/alumni-donors/heard-it-through-the-ai-openai-ilya-sutskever/ https://magazine.utoronto.ca/people/alumni-donors/heard-it-t... Hinton left last week as well.
- krackers 3y ago
  >and it's one of the most used products in the world... And they had their lunch completely eaten by deepL
  - onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
    Did they? I've never heard of deepL, and Google Translate still has close to 1 billion users.
    - krackers 3y ago
      In terms of wider userbase Google Translate is still de facto, but anyone who uses MTL heavily knows that DeepL beats Google Translate for most languages, especially east asian ones.
      - onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
        Sure - and Ubuntu is better than Windows. In business, it doesn't really matter.
- coolspot 3y ago
  > But around 2000, everyone and their mother was talking about how MSFT can't produce any software beside complete garbage. > None of that was true. Ummm… In 2000s MSFT was producing complete garbage. Internet Explorer, Windows XP then ME, Windows Phone, ASP, Bing.
- lmm 3y ago
  > I mean, Google Translate has been basically completely AI powered for 5+ years, and it's one of the most used products in the world... It's also the single clearest example of a product that's been left behind by the "AI revolution" - while Google may still have the numbers (like Yahoo Search did back in the day), DeepL is what serious people use. > The majority of what you see on SERPs has been AI generated for a decade, and that's Google's main money maker. It's also got subjectively worse and worse over that same time period. Demand for a better search engine is higher than it's been for decades.
  - jiggawatts 3y ago
    And DeepL translate is blown out of the water by Chat GPT 4. I tested GPT 3.5, GPT 4.0, Google Translate, and DeepL on some "difficult" sentences, and GPT 4 was the only one that could translate them correctly. Not only that, it could do style shifts in non-English languages, such as "make this more formal", "less formal", "idiomatic", etc... I suspect that GPT 4 is so good at translation is because it understands what it is translating at a near-human level. I like this snippet: "John Bear from Bear Stearns was bearish about bear pelt futures on the Bear City bear markets." Which GPT 4 can round-trip from English -> Hungarian -> Chinese -> English again and outputs this: "John Bell comes from Bellsterns and has a very strong bearish sentiment on the future value of bear skins in the Bear City bear market." Interesting to note that it used a sounds-alike-to-Chinese-speakers "Bell" for "Bear" in proper names. Other than that, this is pretty good, which is very impressive. DeepL and Google Translate shreds the first step and have no hope on a round-trip this long across such unrelated languages. For example, DeepL outputs some gibberish about bear claws (the pastry) and bear cubs!?
- dmix 3y ago
  Google could also integrate their translation service into their consumer AR product that's coming out in 2024 to do live translations, directions, and other real-time image "AI" analysis stuff. A ChatGPT type assistant built into your day-to-day life could be interesting. If not for Q&A other use cases we don't yet know about. https://www.techradar.com/features/google-glass-2-everything-we-know-and-want-to-see https://www.techradar.com/features/google-glass-2-everything... Apple is apparently announcing their AR glasses in June https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2023-04-02/when-is-apple-aapl-announcing-its-mixed-reality-headset-june-5-at-wwdc-2023-lfzggfhe?sref=HrWXCALa https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2023-04-02/when-i...
kernal 3y ago
OpenAI must be sweating profusely after viewing that I/O presentation. Not only do they not have the integration, scale and user base of Google, but the migration of Bard to PaLM 2 it will exceed whatever OpenAI currently has. Also, it's only a matter of time before their top employee's are poached by Apple and Google.
- satvikpendem 3y ago
  Well I guess that internal memo was true, there is no moat in AI, for Google, OpenAI, or any other, as long as AI continues to improve.
  - bo-tao 3y ago
    What does it mean to have no moat?
    - ducttapecrown 3y ago
      A "moat" is the protection company A has against company B building a clone of company A's product. For example, YouTube has the set of people who have a habit of logging on to YouTube to watch content. A competitor has to convince all those people to change their habits. This is known to be a hard problem, so it's a moat! Netflix thought they had a similar moat of user-habits. But it turns out that the more important moat in the streaming market is a moat of content.
    - satvikpendem 3y ago
      Here's the article I was referring to: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35813322 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35813322
    - sweeds 3y ago
      No competitive advantage that protects the business. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_moat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_moat
- motoboi 3y ago

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago

I mean, Google Translate has been basically completely AI powered for 5+ years, and it's one of the most used products in the world... The majority of what you see on SERPs has been AI generated for a decade, and that's Google's main money maker. This idea that Google sucks at AI and is clearly a million miles behind is intriguing. Google is currently the company everyone loves to hate like MSFT was 5-10 years ago. THAT is a bad sign regardless if anything the people are saying has any truth to it. MSFT has been the king of enterprise software since the 80s. But around 2000, everyone and their mother was talking about how MSFT can't produce any software beside complete garbage. None of that was true. But, MSFT was in for some relatively bad times for a decade or so. I suspect the same thing is going to happen to Google just because sentiment is powerful.

motoboi 3y ago
You now that, I know that, everyone knows that. And yet, google stresses it everytime, like the company is anxious that people is looking for OpenAI and not google.
- nr2x 3y ago
  Some of the key people behind translate founded OpenAI. Don’t forget it’s always been about the people, not the brand. Google was good at attracting and retaining the best and brightest. Now they aren’t.
  - eclipxe 3y ago
    Citation needed?
    - nr2x 3y ago
      Ask and ye shall receive: “Based in part on his work with Hinton, Sutskever was hired by Google. There, he implemented a neural-network-driven approach to language translation that produced fewer errors than competing efforts. His work provided the basis for a major upgrade to Google Translate. “Researchers didn’t believe that neural networks could do translation, so it was a big surprise when they could,” he says.” https://magazine.utoronto.ca/people/alumni-donors/heard-it-through-the-ai-openai-ilya-sutskever/ https://magazine.utoronto.ca/people/alumni-donors/heard-it-t... Hinton left last week as well.
krackers 3y ago
>and it's one of the most used products in the world... And they had their lunch completely eaten by deepL
- onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
  Did they? I've never heard of deepL, and Google Translate still has close to 1 billion users.
  - krackers 3y ago
    In terms of wider userbase Google Translate is still de facto, but anyone who uses MTL heavily knows that DeepL beats Google Translate for most languages, especially east asian ones.
    - onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
      Sure - and Ubuntu is better than Windows. In business, it doesn't really matter.
coolspot 3y ago
> But around 2000, everyone and their mother was talking about how MSFT can't produce any software beside complete garbage. > None of that was true. Ummm… In 2000s MSFT was producing complete garbage. Internet Explorer, Windows XP then ME, Windows Phone, ASP, Bing.
lmm 3y ago
> I mean, Google Translate has been basically completely AI powered for 5+ years, and it's one of the most used products in the world... It's also the single clearest example of a product that's been left behind by the "AI revolution" - while Google may still have the numbers (like Yahoo Search did back in the day), DeepL is what serious people use. > The majority of what you see on SERPs has been AI generated for a decade, and that's Google's main money maker. It's also got subjectively worse and worse over that same time period. Demand for a better search engine is higher than it's been for decades.
- jiggawatts 3y ago
  And DeepL translate is blown out of the water by Chat GPT 4. I tested GPT 3.5, GPT 4.0, Google Translate, and DeepL on some "difficult" sentences, and GPT 4 was the only one that could translate them correctly. Not only that, it could do style shifts in non-English languages, such as "make this more formal", "less formal", "idiomatic", etc... I suspect that GPT 4 is so good at translation is because it understands what it is translating at a near-human level. I like this snippet: "John Bear from Bear Stearns was bearish about bear pelt futures on the Bear City bear markets." Which GPT 4 can round-trip from English -> Hungarian -> Chinese -> English again and outputs this: "John Bell comes from Bellsterns and has a very strong bearish sentiment on the future value of bear skins in the Bear City bear market." Interesting to note that it used a sounds-alike-to-Chinese-speakers "Bell" for "Bear" in proper names. Other than that, this is pretty good, which is very impressive. DeepL and Google Translate shreds the first step and have no hope on a round-trip this long across such unrelated languages. For example, DeepL outputs some gibberish about bear claws (the pastry) and bear cubs!?
dmix 3y ago
Google could also integrate their translation service into their consumer AR product that's coming out in 2024 to do live translations, directions, and other real-time image "AI" analysis stuff. A ChatGPT type assistant built into your day-to-day life could be interesting. If not for Q&A other use cases we don't yet know about. https://www.techradar.com/features/google-glass-2-everything-we-know-and-want-to-see https://www.techradar.com/features/google-glass-2-everything... Apple is apparently announcing their AR glasses in June https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2023-04-02/when-is-apple-aapl-announcing-its-mixed-reality-headset-june-5-at-wwdc-2023-lfzggfhe?sref=HrWXCALa https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2023-04-02/when-i...

kernal 3y ago

OpenAI must be sweating profusely after viewing that I/O presentation. Not only do they not have the integration, scale and user base of Google, but the migration of Bard to PaLM 2 it will exceed whatever OpenAI currently has. Also, it's only a matter of time before their top employee's are poached by Apple and Google.

satvikpendem 3y ago
Well I guess that internal memo was true, there is no moat in AI, for Google, OpenAI, or any other, as long as AI continues to improve.
- bo-tao 3y ago
  What does it mean to have no moat?
  - ducttapecrown 3y ago
    A "moat" is the protection company A has against company B building a clone of company A's product. For example, YouTube has the set of people who have a habit of logging on to YouTube to watch content. A competitor has to convince all those people to change their habits. This is known to be a hard problem, so it's a moat! Netflix thought they had a similar moat of user-habits. But it turns out that the more important moat in the streaming market is a moat of content.
  - satvikpendem 3y ago
    Here's the article I was referring to: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35813322 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35813322
  - sweeds 3y ago
    No competitive advantage that protects the business. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_moat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_moat
motoboi 3y ago