> they encourage inefficient use of land in urban environments I think that depends on which country/state you are in. In the UK, I'm sure there are people wh

> they encourage inefficient use of land in urban environments I think that depends on which country/state you are in. In the UK, I'm sure there are people who want to turn everywhere into a market garden. However the permaculture hippies that I grew up with were far more pragmatic. They used the land that was near by and not being used. But as you point out, there is a mix of opinion, and it all needs to be critically evaluated.