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I don't think it's a generational thing. My contention is that smugness kills satire. McSweeney's can be very smug. Some people obviously disagree (since satir

I don't think it's a generational thing. My contention is that smugness kills satire. McSweeney's can be very smug. Some people obviously disagree (since satire that I consider to be smug are popular, and because satire does have a broader definition than what I'm saying), but satire works best when an outsider voice has a bit of earnestness and empathy as he punches up. Otherwise, it feels self-indulgent, insular, mean-spirited, or preachy.

gbjw 3y ago
This is a freelance writer lampooning overpaid neural network mechanics and "maybe we're all just auto-complete models" philosophy bros and their myopic search for efficiency and "intelligence". "Punching up" is a relative term -- in many circles the latter group has all the social cache.
- Brendinooo 3y ago
  You're probably right. I thought about this after I posted: Because of the nature of the comment I replied to, I was speaking more generally about McSweeney's than this article specifically.
version_five 3y ago
Good catch. I had wondered what I found off about a lot of modern satire, and yeah, it's smugness. I think it's a side effect of polarization. A lot of jokes aren't just mocking in good fun anymore, they're more just insults to people with different views. Which is ironic because there seems to be a modern narrative that lots of past jokes that were in good fun are actually offensive.
mkr-hn 3y ago
Jordan Klepper comes to mind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1VpraYEUPk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1VpraYEUPk He can interview the most self-stereotyping person, mock them mercilessly, and they'll have no idea because he's so earnest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPNwJAcMH5U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPNwJAcMH5U
- pstuart 3y ago
  Klepper is awesome, but it's still shooting fish in a barrel with that crowd.
zoogeny 3y ago
McSweeney's is a complex combination of things. You are spot on with smug. It is also pretentious but in an ironic way, like they are winking at you (my chief criticism of David Foster Wallace). But I chose sardonic because it includes the cynicism that articles like this one feel full of. From Wikipedia on Sardonicism [1]: To be sardonic is to be disdainfully or cynically humorous, or scornfully mocking.[1][2] A form of wit or humour, being sardonic often involves expressing an uncomfortable truth in a clever and not necessarily malicious way, often with a degree of skepticism I used to love that kind of bitterness, almost like a punk-rock attitude. Maybe my tastes have just changed. Gen-Z does seem to have a similar dark humor tinged with fatalism and irony. It just somehow works better for me. Perhaps it is mixed there with a kind of earnestness that characterized Millennials that helps to removes the smugness? 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sardonicism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sardonicism
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- Brendinooo 3y ago
  I've seen plenty of people younger than me say they dislike "South Park" because "they attack everyone" isn't seen as a virtue; it comes off as overly cynical, opportunistic, nihilistic, etc. Kinda tracks with what you're saying.

gbjw 3y ago

This is a freelance writer lampooning overpaid neural network mechanics and "maybe we're all just auto-complete models" philosophy bros and their myopic search for efficiency and "intelligence". "Punching up" is a relative term -- in many circles the latter group has all the social cache.

Brendinooo 3y ago
You're probably right. I thought about this after I posted: Because of the nature of the comment I replied to, I was speaking more generally about McSweeney's than this article specifically.

version_five 3y ago

Good catch. I had wondered what I found off about a lot of modern satire, and yeah, it's smugness. I think it's a side effect of polarization. A lot of jokes aren't just mocking in good fun anymore, they're more just insults to people with different views. Which is ironic because there seems to be a modern narrative that lots of past jokes that were in good fun are actually offensive.

mkr-hn 3y ago

Jordan Klepper comes to mind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1VpraYEUPk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1VpraYEUPk He can interview the most self-stereotyping person, mock them mercilessly, and they'll have no idea because he's so earnest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPNwJAcMH5U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPNwJAcMH5U

pstuart 3y ago
Klepper is awesome, but it's still shooting fish in a barrel with that crowd.

zoogeny 3y ago

McSweeney's is a complex combination of things. You are spot on with smug. It is also pretentious but in an ironic way, like they are winking at you (my chief criticism of David Foster Wallace). But I chose sardonic because it includes the cynicism that articles like this one feel full of. From Wikipedia on Sardonicism [1]: To be sardonic is to be disdainfully or cynically humorous, or scornfully mocking.[1][2] A form of wit or humour, being sardonic often involves expressing an uncomfortable truth in a clever and not necessarily malicious way, often with a degree of skepticism I used to love that kind of bitterness, almost like a punk-rock attitude. Maybe my tastes have just changed. Gen-Z does seem to have a similar dark humor tinged with fatalism and irony. It just somehow works better for me. Perhaps it is mixed there with a kind of earnestness that characterized Millennials that helps to removes the smugness? 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sardonicism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sardonicism

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
Brendinooo 3y ago
I've seen plenty of people younger than me say they dislike "South Park" because "they attack everyone" isn't seen as a virtue; it comes off as overly cynical, opportunistic, nihilistic, etc. Kinda tracks with what you're saying.