10 ms·

> Having a full DAW on the go is a killer feature imho. Macbook?

dagmx 3y ago
I guess I should expand why not a laptop, but it boils down to removing lots of little friction points that make ephemeral ideas harder to put down. 1. Touch first is important because your instruments are touch as well. Being able to record my live instruments and not have to switch to a trackpad to move between UI elements seems small, but it really keeps me in the zone. 2. Same point above, but basically being able to switch between my live instrument and an on screen virtual one is a big deal to layer up an idea. Can’t do that easily with a trackpad or mouse. 3. There’s something to be said for the mobile platforms single app as a focus model. I know you can full screen a Mac app, or split screen on an iPad, but having a singular focus helps reduce distractions. 4. Weight/portability are quite different. Maybe a MacBook Air would be better, but I take my iPad Pro to more places with me than I take my much heavier MacBook Pro . I’m already taking it to draw on the go, so this is just one more thing I can do without needing to buy a new device or take a heavier one. Edit: oh and number 5 is a big one. I can put my iPad Pro in my existing music stand that works for me at multiple heigh levels. There are laptop stands that might work too, but I already use my iPad for sheet music, so it’s already a convenient setup.
- smoldesu 3y ago
  Even as a paying Bitwig subscriber, I don't get it. My instruments are velocity and aftertouch sensitive. Having a touchscreen interface for these instruments is no better than typing on your keyboard to play notes. And then if you want to plug in hardware, you have to either settle for one thing and no charging or buy a dongle. > being able to switch between my live instrument and an on screen virtual one is a big deal to layer up an idea. Can’t do that easily with a trackpad or mouse. Keyboard shortcuts exist. Failing that, it's one click on my trackpad to switch channels. > There’s something to be said for the mobile platforms single app as a focus model. There's also something to be said for multitasking desktops that give you the flexibility of both. It's a neat option for people who already use Logic Pro, but touch-enabled DAWs have existed for over a decade (and they all kinda suck - ask me how I know). Besides the form-factor of the iPad being fairly convenient, there's no way I'd trade-in my laptop's IO and OS for a mobile one. The iPad doesn't offer enough flexibility to replace my DAW laptop.
  - dagmx 3y ago
    You don’t need to get it. You do you. Every time you’ve replied to one of my comments in the past, it’s been very binary in terms of workflows and the discussions always devolve. So this time I’m leaving it as: I explained why it’s a big deal for me. If you have your own workflows or needs, so be it. But it’s irrelevant to why I like it. I don’t need velocity for a quick idea for example. I just need to get the idea out as quickly as possible. Besides, you can always connect an external midi keyboard or audio interface to an iPad as well.
    - smoldesu 3y ago
      All that's well and good, I'm mostly just agreeing with the people who suggest a Macbook for this. The iPad runs iOS, it's gimped for all kinds of creative applications. I won't judge you if you've found a workflow to apply it to, but the status quo feels unchanged. Professional DAWs existed on iPad before, the world beneath our feet didn't crumble or anything. > Besides, you can always connect an external midi keyboard or audio interface to an iPad as well. Sure? Everyone can use class-compliant USB audio hardware. Android and Linux both support it, for whatever that's worth. Both of those OSes even support audio plugins, too. Not everyone can install MPE drivers or get that Focusrite interface set up properly without software though. That's why I still carry a laptop, it may not apply to everyone.
      - coldtea 3y ago
        >The iPad runs iOS, it's gimped for all kinds of creative applications. It's also a great form for many kinds of creative applications, and it's a very hassle-free, it just works experience for those.
        hammyhavoc 3y ago
        How hassle-free it is for a given workflow or user is highly subjective and relative to the task at hand. The file management on iOS is still a dumpster fire.
- samstave 3y ago
  have the UX such that you can have multiple screens that you swipe btwn... such that you can add screens for DRUM MACHINE 1 through N and you just swipe btwn them... and swipe up or down for media access and other screens. it would be cool to have both apps (final cut for vids and logic for trax) running at the same time with "integration" such that you can swipe btwn video and sound editing on the same final output...
- LegitShady 3y ago
  I think there is a lot going for the music ecosystem on ipad - lots of affordable apps, cheap effects compared to desktop etc. At the same time I don't think the device itself is built with the connectivity for the kind of music making I think about. If all your synths and effects live on the iPad and you don't care about after touch maybe, but if you want to hook external gear up the iPad just isn't made for it. no headphone out. requires an external audio interface to connect to hardware synths. not an aftertouch capable control surface. Not really portable if I have to lug a bunch of supporting equipment to make it usable.
  - giobox 3y ago
    I agree to a large extent, but I've been pleasantly surprised just how much audio hardware works using a USB hub, especially now all iPads have USB-C ports with the exception of the 10.2 inch entry one. Given how many USB accessories now work with the iPad, I really really wish Apple would relent and at least give us two USB ports on the side like the MacBook Air.
    - jachee 3y ago
      I get a spare USB-C port from my Magic Keyboard. I generally plug the charger into it and something else into the on-board port, but I have the option to put devices into both ports.
      - musictubes 3y ago
        The USB C on the Magic Keyboard is for power only.
  - thewebcount 3y ago
    Regarding aftertouch, it does support it in a way (and it's shown in the video). For many synths, after you press a key on the on-screen keyboard, if you hold it and move your finger up towards the back end of the key, it gets translated into aftertouch. GarageBand on iPad has supported this as long as I've been using it (a few years). I don't know if every synth supports it, but there are definitely some who do.
galleywest200 3y ago
The 11-inch iPad (Pro) is much more compact, imo. You can also just mount it flat against some hardware in a rack, or against a wall in a small studio booth.
- robotresearcher 3y ago
  It goes on the ubiquitous music stand, too. Lots of musicians use iPads already to show sheet music.
pdpi 3y ago
Current-gen 12" iPad Pro is 1.5 lbs to the MacBook Air's 2.7 lbs. That's a considerable weight difference still.
- anotherman554 3y ago
  You aren't going to use a keyboard case?
  - pdpi 3y ago
    for music production? I can see how you'd carry a midi keyboard but no keyboard for typing.
    - Cthulhu_ 3y ago
      Real musicians type on a midi keyboard. I mean their text doesn't make sense because their alphabet has only seven letters, but still. (I jest!)
      - jmmcd 3y ago
        Well, you have 7 letters, but you can also use the black keys for keyboard shortcuts.
        jasomill 3y ago
        And pedals! I've half-seriously considered experimenting with an expression pedal as a vertical scroll controller for desktop applications, using a second pedal to switch between relative (pedal position relative to center → scroll velocity, zero movement when pedal position is centered) and absolute (pedal position → page position, zero movement unless pedal position changes) modes. For wide multicolumn IDE/text-editor layouts, spatially-mapped fader banks and/or organ drawbars might also make useful scrollers.
  - pwthornton 3y ago
    I would assume more people using Final Cut Pro will use a keyboard case, but for mobile music production, it there may be more people willing to go without the keyboard case, particularly if you are mostly using it to noodle down ideas, use the on screen instruments, etc.
squokko 3y ago
Personally, I feel like the iPad is very "flow" and the computer is very "precise." When I'm in the zone, just vibing, I'd much prefer to bust out musical ideas on an iPad (assuming no instruments available, of course). When I want to tweak the exact reverb parameters I'd rather have the computer.

I guess I should expand why not a laptop, but it boils down to removing lots of little friction points that make ephemeral ideas harder to put down. 1. Touch first is important because your instruments are touch as well. Being able to record my live instruments and not have to switch to a trackpad to move between UI elements seems small, but it really keeps me in the zone. 2. Same point above, but basically being able to switch between my live instrument and an on screen virtual one is a big deal to layer up an idea. Can’t do that easily with a trackpad or mouse. 3. There’s something to be said for the mobile platforms single app as a focus model. I know you can full screen a Mac app, or split screen on an iPad, but having a singular focus helps reduce distractions. 4. Weight/portability are quite different. Maybe a MacBook Air would be better, but I take my iPad Pro to more places with me than I take my much heavier MacBook Pro . I’m already taking it to draw on the go, so this is just one more thing I can do without needing to buy a new device or take a heavier one. Edit: oh and number 5 is a big one. I can put my iPad Pro in my existing music stand that works for me at multiple heigh levels. There are laptop stands that might work too, but I already use my iPad for sheet music, so it’s already a convenient setup.

smoldesu 3y ago
Even as a paying Bitwig subscriber, I don't get it. My instruments are velocity and aftertouch sensitive. Having a touchscreen interface for these instruments is no better than typing on your keyboard to play notes. And then if you want to plug in hardware, you have to either settle for one thing and no charging or buy a dongle. > being able to switch between my live instrument and an on screen virtual one is a big deal to layer up an idea. Can’t do that easily with a trackpad or mouse. Keyboard shortcuts exist. Failing that, it's one click on my trackpad to switch channels. > There’s something to be said for the mobile platforms single app as a focus model. There's also something to be said for multitasking desktops that give you the flexibility of both. It's a neat option for people who already use Logic Pro, but touch-enabled DAWs have existed for over a decade (and they all kinda suck - ask me how I know). Besides the form-factor of the iPad being fairly convenient, there's no way I'd trade-in my laptop's IO and OS for a mobile one. The iPad doesn't offer enough flexibility to replace my DAW laptop.
- dagmx 3y ago
  You don’t need to get it. You do you. Every time you’ve replied to one of my comments in the past, it’s been very binary in terms of workflows and the discussions always devolve. So this time I’m leaving it as: I explained why it’s a big deal for me. If you have your own workflows or needs, so be it. But it’s irrelevant to why I like it. I don’t need velocity for a quick idea for example. I just need to get the idea out as quickly as possible. Besides, you can always connect an external midi keyboard or audio interface to an iPad as well.
  - smoldesu 3y ago
    All that's well and good, I'm mostly just agreeing with the people who suggest a Macbook for this. The iPad runs iOS, it's gimped for all kinds of creative applications. I won't judge you if you've found a workflow to apply it to, but the status quo feels unchanged. Professional DAWs existed on iPad before, the world beneath our feet didn't crumble or anything. > Besides, you can always connect an external midi keyboard or audio interface to an iPad as well. Sure? Everyone can use class-compliant USB audio hardware. Android and Linux both support it, for whatever that's worth. Both of those OSes even support audio plugins, too. Not everyone can install MPE drivers or get that Focusrite interface set up properly without software though. That's why I still carry a laptop, it may not apply to everyone.
    - coldtea 3y ago
      >The iPad runs iOS, it's gimped for all kinds of creative applications. It's also a great form for many kinds of creative applications, and it's a very hassle-free, it just works experience for those.
      - hammyhavoc 3y ago
        How hassle-free it is for a given workflow or user is highly subjective and relative to the task at hand. The file management on iOS is still a dumpster fire.
samstave 3y ago
have the UX such that you can have multiple screens that you swipe btwn... such that you can add screens for DRUM MACHINE 1 through N and you just swipe btwn them... and swipe up or down for media access and other screens. it would be cool to have both apps (final cut for vids and logic for trax) running at the same time with "integration" such that you can swipe btwn video and sound editing on the same final output...
LegitShady 3y ago
I think there is a lot going for the music ecosystem on ipad - lots of affordable apps, cheap effects compared to desktop etc. At the same time I don't think the device itself is built with the connectivity for the kind of music making I think about. If all your synths and effects live on the iPad and you don't care about after touch maybe, but if you want to hook external gear up the iPad just isn't made for it. no headphone out. requires an external audio interface to connect to hardware synths. not an aftertouch capable control surface. Not really portable if I have to lug a bunch of supporting equipment to make it usable.
- giobox 3y ago
  I agree to a large extent, but I've been pleasantly surprised just how much audio hardware works using a USB hub, especially now all iPads have USB-C ports with the exception of the 10.2 inch entry one. Given how many USB accessories now work with the iPad, I really really wish Apple would relent and at least give us two USB ports on the side like the MacBook Air.
  - jachee 3y ago
    I get a spare USB-C port from my Magic Keyboard. I generally plug the charger into it and something else into the on-board port, but I have the option to put devices into both ports.
    - musictubes 3y ago
      The USB C on the Magic Keyboard is for power only.
- thewebcount 3y ago
  Regarding aftertouch, it does support it in a way (and it's shown in the video). For many synths, after you press a key on the on-screen keyboard, if you hold it and move your finger up towards the back end of the key, it gets translated into aftertouch. GarageBand on iPad has supported this as long as I've been using it (a few years). I don't know if every synth supports it, but there are definitely some who do.

galleywest200 3y ago

The 11-inch iPad (Pro) is much more compact, imo. You can also just mount it flat against some hardware in a rack, or against a wall in a small studio booth.

robotresearcher 3y ago
It goes on the ubiquitous music stand, too. Lots of musicians use iPads already to show sheet music.

pdpi 3y ago

Current-gen 12" iPad Pro is 1.5 lbs to the MacBook Air's 2.7 lbs. That's a considerable weight difference still.

anotherman554 3y ago
You aren't going to use a keyboard case?
- pdpi 3y ago
  for music production? I can see how you'd carry a midi keyboard but no keyboard for typing.
  - Cthulhu_ 3y ago
    Real musicians type on a midi keyboard. I mean their text doesn't make sense because their alphabet has only seven letters, but still. (I jest!)
    - jmmcd 3y ago
      Well, you have 7 letters, but you can also use the black keys for keyboard shortcuts.
      - jasomill 3y ago
        And pedals! I've half-seriously considered experimenting with an expression pedal as a vertical scroll controller for desktop applications, using a second pedal to switch between relative (pedal position relative to center → scroll velocity, zero movement when pedal position is centered) and absolute (pedal position → page position, zero movement unless pedal position changes) modes. For wide multicolumn IDE/text-editor layouts, spatially-mapped fader banks and/or organ drawbars might also make useful scrollers.
- pwthornton 3y ago
  I would assume more people using Final Cut Pro will use a keyboard case, but for mobile music production, it there may be more people willing to go without the keyboard case, particularly if you are mostly using it to noodle down ideas, use the on screen instruments, etc.

squokko 3y ago

Personally, I feel like the iPad is very "flow" and the computer is very "precise." When I'm in the zone, just vibing, I'd much prefer to bust out musical ideas on an iPad (assuming no instruments available, of course). When I want to tweak the exact reverb parameters I'd rather have the computer.