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I'd much rather pay $50/year and get perpetual updates than the old price of $199 one time. Yes, I'd rather pay $5 one time and get free updates forever, but I

I'd much rather pay $50/year and get perpetual updates than the old price of $199 one time. Yes, I'd rather pay $5 one time and get free updates forever, but I just can't see complaining about $4/month for anything I get ongoing value from.

nottorp 4y ago
You like losing access when you cancel the subscription? Or when an older device is cut off from the app store?
- zuppy 4y ago
  what older device is cut off from the app store? you get to keep that version that you have and the subscription will go on.
  - nottorp 4y ago
    You can see into the future?
    - zuppy 4y ago
      no, i can see into the past and you're being disingenuous. this is the current way that older apps are supported, and compared to android, apple provides longest support for older os versions. the ones that are not supporten anymore get to keep (and download) the latest compatible version of the app. i had a device where i tested that.
- spacephysics 4y ago
  As many readers here probably understand from first hand experience, software isn’t a final product (typically). The majority of software requires maintenance and any ongoing feature updates have a continual cost on the company. If they asked for a subscription and said, no more updates after tomorrow, then sure that’s Bs. But especially for something like Final Cut, you’ll get continual updates and feature improvements, and you get recurring value. I’m all for FOSS, but there are many cases where the paid incentive version is far better than open offerings, and that’s just how it is today.
  - dmreedy 4y ago
    I don't think the concern is that the subscription doesn't bring value. Just that it builds no equity. Once the renting agreement ends, you lose all the access you once had, not just access to future things to come. (edit: I don't know if this is actually true of Final Cut Pro's model)
    - crazygringo 4y ago
      Right, but that's the tradeoff and it's a good tradeoff for many. If you only need Final Cut Pro for a 2-month project, it's amazing because you'll save so much money. And any time you need it again, you just resubscribe. You're never losing access permanently, it's just $5 away. The point is that the flexibility and ongoing updates are a more beneficial tradeoff. A lot of people (like myself) simply don't care about owning equity in software, so we have eternal access. It's just a tool, and it loses value over time without updates anyways.
      - nottorp 4y ago
        > It's just a tool, and it loses value over time without updates anyways. Why? It will continue to do exactly the same thing. If that thing had no value to you why are you getting it? Edit: > Because the world moves forward. Something that might have worked well 5 years ago but has had no updates or improvements to keep up with competition is ultimately not as useful as it once was. Not everything is a javascript library though.
        mynameisvlad 4y ago
        Because the world moves forward. Something that might have worked well 5 years ago but has had no updates or improvements to keep up with competition is ultimately not as useful as it once was. Depending on how good other software has gotten, it very well could be a case of wasting money by not switching over depending on how much you value your time.
        massysett 4y ago
- Someone 4y ago
  Or when Apple decides to completely cancel the product across all devices? I know Apple is growing towards being a service provider, but they have a long history of dropping support for older soft- and hardware. Staying at an older OS or old hardware or running unsupported software isn’t ideal, but with a SaaS offering, the provider can cut access overnight.
jcpst 4y ago
Interesting- I'd much rather pay the perpetual fee. At home, I run a 13 year old Mac Mini in my studio. Everything DAW related on it still works, and it's all compatible with each other. This is quite common in many studios I've worked in. It's not unusual to be running 10-15+ year old machines. Everything is updated as far as it's ever going to go on that hardware. I do like the Jetbrains model where there is a perpetual fallback license. It think that would be a good balance for software like DAWs.
- _joel 4y ago
  Do you have an audio interface and is it the same one you started with? Does it still get driver updates ooi?
  - jcpst 4y ago
    That setup is using an Apogee Duet Firewire. I had an original digidesign mbox (USB 1!) hooked up to the Mini before that. The original Duet stopped getting driver updates a few years back. For a while, apogee had a trade-in deal if you sent them your old firewire interface, but then I would have had to update hardware + software to support it. The last update I did was OSX from 10.11 to 10.13, and this was partly to keep some of the project work synchronizing with dropbox. At this point I'm kind of just keeping this system alive to get through my latest project and observing the first few years of Apple Silicon before I build a new system.

nottorp 4y ago

You like losing access when you cancel the subscription? Or when an older device is cut off from the app store?

zuppy 4y ago
what older device is cut off from the app store? you get to keep that version that you have and the subscription will go on.
- nottorp 4y ago
  You can see into the future?
  - zuppy 4y ago
    no, i can see into the past and you're being disingenuous. this is the current way that older apps are supported, and compared to android, apple provides longest support for older os versions. the ones that are not supporten anymore get to keep (and download) the latest compatible version of the app. i had a device where i tested that.
spacephysics 4y ago
As many readers here probably understand from first hand experience, software isn’t a final product (typically). The majority of software requires maintenance and any ongoing feature updates have a continual cost on the company. If they asked for a subscription and said, no more updates after tomorrow, then sure that’s Bs. But especially for something like Final Cut, you’ll get continual updates and feature improvements, and you get recurring value. I’m all for FOSS, but there are many cases where the paid incentive version is far better than open offerings, and that’s just how it is today.
- dmreedy 4y ago
  I don't think the concern is that the subscription doesn't bring value. Just that it builds no equity. Once the renting agreement ends, you lose all the access you once had, not just access to future things to come. (edit: I don't know if this is actually true of Final Cut Pro's model)
  - crazygringo 4y ago
    Right, but that's the tradeoff and it's a good tradeoff for many. If you only need Final Cut Pro for a 2-month project, it's amazing because you'll save so much money. And any time you need it again, you just resubscribe. You're never losing access permanently, it's just $5 away. The point is that the flexibility and ongoing updates are a more beneficial tradeoff. A lot of people (like myself) simply don't care about owning equity in software, so we have eternal access. It's just a tool, and it loses value over time without updates anyways.
    - nottorp 4y ago
      > It's just a tool, and it loses value over time without updates anyways. Why? It will continue to do exactly the same thing. If that thing had no value to you why are you getting it? Edit: > Because the world moves forward. Something that might have worked well 5 years ago but has had no updates or improvements to keep up with competition is ultimately not as useful as it once was. Not everything is a javascript library though.
      - mynameisvlad 4y ago
        Because the world moves forward. Something that might have worked well 5 years ago but has had no updates or improvements to keep up with competition is ultimately not as useful as it once was. Depending on how good other software has gotten, it very well could be a case of wasting money by not switching over depending on how much you value your time.
      - massysett 4y ago
Someone 4y ago
Or when Apple decides to completely cancel the product across all devices? I know Apple is growing towards being a service provider, but they have a long history of dropping support for older soft- and hardware. Staying at an older OS or old hardware or running unsupported software isn’t ideal, but with a SaaS offering, the provider can cut access overnight.

jcpst 4y ago

Interesting- I'd much rather pay the perpetual fee. At home, I run a 13 year old Mac Mini in my studio. Everything DAW related on it still works, and it's all compatible with each other. This is quite common in many studios I've worked in. It's not unusual to be running 10-15+ year old machines. Everything is updated as far as it's ever going to go on that hardware. I do like the Jetbrains model where there is a perpetual fallback license. It think that would be a good balance for software like DAWs.

_joel 4y ago
Do you have an audio interface and is it the same one you started with? Does it still get driver updates ooi?
- jcpst 4y ago
  That setup is using an Apogee Duet Firewire. I had an original digidesign mbox (USB 1!) hooked up to the Mini before that. The original Duet stopped getting driver updates a few years back. For a while, apogee had a trade-in deal if you sent them your old firewire interface, but then I would have had to update hardware + software to support it. The last update I did was OSX from 10.11 to 10.13, and this was partly to keep some of the project work synchronizing with dropbox. At this point I'm kind of just keeping this system alive to get through my latest project and observing the first few years of Apple Silicon before I build a new system.