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In 2006/2007 I was paid for a project in e-gold[0]. Another currency backed by gold bullion. I never saw the gold, never touched it, but was assured it was ther

by yardie 3y ago

In 2006/2007 I was paid for a project in e-gold[0]. Another currency backed by gold bullion. I never saw the gold, never touched it, but was assured it was there, really. The whole thing went tits up because it was a scam. Being in Texas and not Panama I guess this is slightly less scammy. But I suspect the people who want to hold gold will simply buy gold. And skip the questionably middleman. [0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold

silverpepsi 3y ago
The problem is fraction reserves, as soon as that fraud is legalized, the entire marketplace is by definition fraudulent. If they did have reserves and fraction reserve was suddenly legalized, you get retroactively robbed in a sense. Holding gold would appeal to me but is impossible. I won't dedicate my life, hell or high water, to one country. You can't just up and carry stuff across nation borders. It is a total nightmare. In fact, every time I enter Thailand (and who knows how many other countries) I break the law. The limit for undeclared personal affects is exceeded by a single tshirt or pair of jeans in my luggage, since, well I wear all designer. Strikes me as beyond absurd how the world works ever since the idiocy of passports, permission, and visas was introduced:( One of the worst inventions in history imo. I think Ukraine should remind us all not to trust everything to one country. All your eggs in one basket
- zpeti 3y ago
  > One of the worst inventions in history imo. As opposed to what? Roaming tribes of mongols, and castles where you couldnt leave if the king didn’t let you? What did you think happened if you left your tribe in hunter gatherer tribes? You got eaten by a jaguar on the next tree, or you starved. What romantic notion do you hold of the world before visas and passports?
  - silverpepsi 3y ago
    Fair enough. To be specific, as opposed to immediately before passports were invented I imagine it was similar to what it was like: 1. Before police patrolled in America 2. Before driver's licenses (you can still experience this in Cambodia, low CC scooters don't require a license) 3. Before tattoo artists needed a medical license in Japan and Korea Ya know, liberty and basic rights that have now been abrogated to such a degree that the herd not only doesn't remember what they were like, but actually questions the validity of even being that "free". (Populations like China tend to think a central authority not controlling speech is absurd too.)
ur-whale 3y ago
While I tend to systematically doubt anything that "represents" gold supposedly stored somewhere and therefore tend to agree with the sentiment, I believe that if an actual state were to implement this, along with: - a system of independent, redundant audits of the reserves (independent as in: they would not live in Texas) - a blockchain to track and record for all eternity the state of the currency *and* the audits - a guarantee etched in stone in the Texas constitution that the e-currency is - by law - instantly convertible to the real thing (and by that, I mean actual gold, not the current market rate equivalent in toilet paper). then it would have a chance of succeeding. But again, there are so many ways to cheat and lie when you manage a gold "reserve", including storing fake gold, that - indeed - while this would be a lot easier to handle and trade with than real gold, it would still not replace it.
vintagedave 3y ago
The Wikipedia article* makes it sound fairly legit, and that it collapsed because it didn't verify members well and so was used for illegal purposes. But not because it was a scam. It reads that it was widely used, and the article _implies_ it was genuinely backed by gold. Do you have more insight here? I'd never heard of E-gold before today. [*] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold

by yardie 3y ago

silverpepsi 3y ago

The problem is fraction reserves, as soon as that fraud is legalized, the entire marketplace is by definition fraudulent. If they did have reserves and fraction reserve was suddenly legalized, you get retroactively robbed in a sense. Holding gold would appeal to me but is impossible. I won't dedicate my life, hell or high water, to one country. You can't just up and carry stuff across nation borders. It is a total nightmare. In fact, every time I enter Thailand (and who knows how many other countries) I break the law. The limit for undeclared personal affects is exceeded by a single tshirt or pair of jeans in my luggage, since, well I wear all designer. Strikes me as beyond absurd how the world works ever since the idiocy of passports, permission, and visas was introduced:( One of the worst inventions in history imo. I think Ukraine should remind us all not to trust everything to one country. All your eggs in one basket

zpeti 3y ago
> One of the worst inventions in history imo. As opposed to what? Roaming tribes of mongols, and castles where you couldnt leave if the king didn’t let you? What did you think happened if you left your tribe in hunter gatherer tribes? You got eaten by a jaguar on the next tree, or you starved. What romantic notion do you hold of the world before visas and passports?
- silverpepsi 3y ago
  Fair enough. To be specific, as opposed to immediately before passports were invented I imagine it was similar to what it was like: 1. Before police patrolled in America 2. Before driver's licenses (you can still experience this in Cambodia, low CC scooters don't require a license) 3. Before tattoo artists needed a medical license in Japan and Korea Ya know, liberty and basic rights that have now been abrogated to such a degree that the herd not only doesn't remember what they were like, but actually questions the validity of even being that "free". (Populations like China tend to think a central authority not controlling speech is absurd too.)

ur-whale 3y ago

While I tend to systematically doubt anything that "represents" gold supposedly stored somewhere and therefore tend to agree with the sentiment, I believe that if an actual state were to implement this, along with: - a system of independent, redundant audits of the reserves (independent as in: they would not live in Texas) - a blockchain to track and record for all eternity the state of the currency *and* the audits - a guarantee etched in stone in the Texas constitution that the e-currency is - by law - instantly convertible to the real thing (and by that, I mean actual gold, not the current market rate equivalent in toilet paper). then it would have a chance of succeeding. But again, there are so many ways to cheat and lie when you manage a gold "reserve", including storing fake gold, that - indeed - while this would be a lot easier to handle and trade with than real gold, it would still not replace it.

vintagedave 3y ago

The Wikipedia article* makes it sound fairly legit, and that it collapsed because it didn't verify members well and so was used for illegal purposes. But not because it was a scam. It reads that it was widely used, and the article _implies_ it was genuinely backed by gold. Do you have more insight here? I'd never heard of E-gold before today. [*] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold