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In what way was the plastic bags sensible? We replaced recycled and sugar cane bags with awful cotton bags while instead importing garbage bags from China. The

In what way was the plastic bags sensible? We replaced recycled and sugar cane bags with awful cotton bags while instead importing garbage bags from China. The sale of imported plastic bags skyrocketed.

actionfromafar 3y ago
So ban the China bags.
- suddenclarity 3y ago
  The issue is with how the garbage system works. You need to put your tampons, condoms, diapers, etc. into something at home for the garbage truck to pick them up. If you don't solve the issue, people will just continue to the next solution. Maybe cotton bags that are absolutely terrible for the environment.
mandmandam 3y ago
> In what way was the plastic bags sensible? In the way that the number of trees I've seen covered in plastic bags has dropped > 99%. Seeing 5 or 6 plastic bags at once blowing in the wind, down > 99%. In the way that microplastics is a bad thing, and reducing the amount of them is good. > We replaced recycled and sugar cane bags with awful cotton bags What proportion of those plastic bags we banned were "recycled and sugar cane bags"? And that's not what your initial argument was. I'd have liked to see them replaced with hemp, myself, but I'd rather see a cotton bag degrading peacefully than a plastic bag leeching random nasty shit everywhere. >The sale of imported plastic bags skyrocketed. Did it "skyrocket" to more than the number of bags we were producing before? No, not anywhere. In South Australia, for example, 400 million fewer plastic bags were used.
- ZeroGravitas 3y ago
  Plastic bag bans are total catnip for libertarians, particularly that large subset funded by fossil fuels. There is nothing they hate more than widely popular and successful regulations to reduce fossil fuel use. So repeated attempts to discredit them are made. https://reason.com/tag/plastic-bags/ https://reason.com/tag/plastic-bags/ They don't really stand up to scrutiny though: https://www.nrdc.org/stories/do-plastic-bag-bans-work https://www.nrdc.org/stories/do-plastic-bag-bans-work
- suddenclarity 3y ago
  > Seeing 5 or 6 plastic bags at once blowing in the wind, down > 99%. I've never seen that. There's no trash on the ground where I live. I hope you picked it up. > What proportion of those plastic bags we banned were "recycled and sugar cane bags"? I have no numbers but probably 80+ percent considering all food chains and the biggest retail stores had made the change many years ago. That's where most of the bags were coming from. The ones you used multiple times when purchasing food, before using it as a garbage bag. > Did it "skyrocket" to more than the number of bags we were producing before? Yes. In the past you bought a recycled plastic bag, used it a couple of times and then disposed it with the garbage such as tampons. Now you buy rolls of imported plastic bags and use them for garbage but since there's no incitament to buy fewer, you stock up when its cheap. With the added benefit that you also have to buy cotton bags that are absolutely terrible for the environment. As a result, the change is being rolled back this year by the government. Everyone have deemed it to be a major failure.

actionfromafar 3y ago

So ban the China bags.

suddenclarity 3y ago
The issue is with how the garbage system works. You need to put your tampons, condoms, diapers, etc. into something at home for the garbage truck to pick them up. If you don't solve the issue, people will just continue to the next solution. Maybe cotton bags that are absolutely terrible for the environment.

mandmandam 3y ago

> In what way was the plastic bags sensible? In the way that the number of trees I've seen covered in plastic bags has dropped > 99%. Seeing 5 or 6 plastic bags at once blowing in the wind, down > 99%. In the way that microplastics is a bad thing, and reducing the amount of them is good. > We replaced recycled and sugar cane bags with awful cotton bags What proportion of those plastic bags we banned were "recycled and sugar cane bags"? And that's not what your initial argument was. I'd have liked to see them replaced with hemp, myself, but I'd rather see a cotton bag degrading peacefully than a plastic bag leeching random nasty shit everywhere. >The sale of imported plastic bags skyrocketed. Did it "skyrocket" to more than the number of bags we were producing before? No, not anywhere. In South Australia, for example, 400 million fewer plastic bags were used.

ZeroGravitas 3y ago
Plastic bag bans are total catnip for libertarians, particularly that large subset funded by fossil fuels. There is nothing they hate more than widely popular and successful regulations to reduce fossil fuel use. So repeated attempts to discredit them are made. https://reason.com/tag/plastic-bags/ https://reason.com/tag/plastic-bags/ They don't really stand up to scrutiny though: https://www.nrdc.org/stories/do-plastic-bag-bans-work https://www.nrdc.org/stories/do-plastic-bag-bans-work
suddenclarity 3y ago
> Seeing 5 or 6 plastic bags at once blowing in the wind, down > 99%. I've never seen that. There's no trash on the ground where I live. I hope you picked it up. > What proportion of those plastic bags we banned were "recycled and sugar cane bags"? I have no numbers but probably 80+ percent considering all food chains and the biggest retail stores had made the change many years ago. That's where most of the bags were coming from. The ones you used multiple times when purchasing food, before using it as a garbage bag. > Did it "skyrocket" to more than the number of bags we were producing before? Yes. In the past you bought a recycled plastic bag, used it a couple of times and then disposed it with the garbage such as tampons. Now you buy rolls of imported plastic bags and use them for garbage but since there's no incitament to buy fewer, you stock up when its cheap. With the added benefit that you also have to buy cotton bags that are absolutely terrible for the environment. As a result, the change is being rolled back this year by the government. Everyone have deemed it to be a major failure.