4 ms·

As a non-US citizen/resident, I can't wait for Americans to finally riot against tipping, just so they stop doing it abroad. A shame that it had to take comical

As a non-US citizen/resident, I can't wait for Americans to finally riot against tipping, just so they stop doing it abroad. A shame that it had to take comical proportions domestically for people to start questioning it. Americans tipping abroad while on holidays ruins service for everyone that isn't American – as a non-American you are guaranteed to get worse service than a American in touristy places (and sometimes, to add insult to injury, your own local places), because an American tourist will just insist on tipping 20% or more in places where maybe 1€ = good tip and 2€ = great tip. It doesn't matter if they repeatedly get told not to do it, American tourists keep insisting on doing it to "be nice". The result is that hospitality obviously optimises for being extra nice to Americans and treat everyone else with apathy. And because you only tip at the end, it doesn't even matter if you were willing to tip like an American, you're going to get the bad treatment (and by then when the bill arrives any motivation to tip well is gone – a classic catch-22). You're basically discriminated for not looking and speaking with an American accent everywhere you go as a tourist. Please, inform yourselves of tipping cultures when you travel and do it appropriately. Also take in consideration a lot of "this is how much you should tip" guides online are horrible wrong and err on the side of overstating the tip (no idea why – possibly not to offend US sensitivities?). You'd think with all the "cultural appropriation" and "cultural imperialism" awareness these days people would be better in not imposing toxic parts of their culture elsewhere, but here we are.

yowzadave 3y ago
> hospitality obviously optimises for being extra nice to Americans and treat everyone else with apathy Maybe this is how the tipping practice got started in the first place?
- disruptiveink 3y ago
  Ignoring for a moment the 20% premium, the issue is that in the US, (mostly) everyone is American. Unless you're a regular, hospitality has no way of telling whether you're a good tipper or a bad tipper. There may be "tells" or "feelings", but that's the extent of it. So when you walk into a place, you're going to get the same service as the next guy. Your logic may track for regulars (a repeat customer may tip to get nicer service next time), but that's not the phenomenon that I was describing. If you're in a touristy place and you're not American, if the place in particular has seen enough Americans, they're going to treat you badly because in their mind, you're taking up the table of an American tourist which would give them a lot of free money for doing the same work. I, as a non-American tourist who has never been in that particular place before, have no way of opting out of the "bad service mode" and opting into the "American service mode" – I obviously don't have an American accent. I obviously can't state "I'm going to tip you 20%!" at the beginning of the service – I'd look like a deranged person.
  - peteradio 3y ago
    Maybe try wearing a cowboy hat and imitate a high rolling Texan.
  - catiopatio 3y ago
    > I obviously can't state "I'm going to tip you 20%!" at the beginning of the service – I'd look like a deranged person. When I’m at smaller restaurant where the staff doesn’t know me well, and want to signal “I’m going to tip you well!”, I’ll often get an expensive drink at the bar beforehand and massively overtip. The staff obviously talks to each other, and in my non-scientific study, this fairly consistently results in a better service outcome.
  - ricardobayes 3y ago
    I don't think this would work in Munich or Vienna, you could be the pope and they would still be rude to you.
catiopatio 3y ago
I’ve never tipped 20% in places without a tipping culture, but I must admit your comment makes me think I should — at least, in the places where a tip would not be considered insulting. I tip in the US to receive better service. If it’s not considered rude to tip, and it results in better service, why wouldn’t I do that?
- disruptiveink 3y ago
  You won't get better service – that's my point, the next guy who sounds like you will. If people who look and speak like you tip disproportionately, everyone else that looks and speaks that way will get great service by default, even if they don't tip, at expense of everyone else now getting bad service. This of course doesn't apply if you are a regular, feel free to do whatever you want. The staff will treat you well because it's you, not because of the stereotype your accent implies.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - godelski 3y ago
    > You won't get better service – that's my point, the next guy who sounds like you will Sounds like the same thing to me. Just playing as a team instead of an individual.
- mikrl 3y ago
  >I tip in the US to receive better service How does this work, unless you tip before being served?
ricardobayes 3y ago
This is going like this for a long time, as a local in Eastern Europe I was sick and tired of getting a frown or a shit service, but the American couple next to me had "their feet kissed" so to say. This creates the weird duality you see on many sites that Americans are raving about eastern european places but the locals always comment "what? no, don't come here, it's crap here".

yowzadave 3y ago

> hospitality obviously optimises for being extra nice to Americans and treat everyone else with apathy Maybe this is how the tipping practice got started in the first place?

disruptiveink 3y ago
Ignoring for a moment the 20% premium, the issue is that in the US, (mostly) everyone is American. Unless you're a regular, hospitality has no way of telling whether you're a good tipper or a bad tipper. There may be "tells" or "feelings", but that's the extent of it. So when you walk into a place, you're going to get the same service as the next guy. Your logic may track for regulars (a repeat customer may tip to get nicer service next time), but that's not the phenomenon that I was describing. If you're in a touristy place and you're not American, if the place in particular has seen enough Americans, they're going to treat you badly because in their mind, you're taking up the table of an American tourist which would give them a lot of free money for doing the same work. I, as a non-American tourist who has never been in that particular place before, have no way of opting out of the "bad service mode" and opting into the "American service mode" – I obviously don't have an American accent. I obviously can't state "I'm going to tip you 20%!" at the beginning of the service – I'd look like a deranged person.
- peteradio 3y ago
  Maybe try wearing a cowboy hat and imitate a high rolling Texan.
- catiopatio 3y ago
  > I obviously can't state "I'm going to tip you 20%!" at the beginning of the service – I'd look like a deranged person. When I’m at smaller restaurant where the staff doesn’t know me well, and want to signal “I’m going to tip you well!”, I’ll often get an expensive drink at the bar beforehand and massively overtip. The staff obviously talks to each other, and in my non-scientific study, this fairly consistently results in a better service outcome.
- ricardobayes 3y ago
  I don't think this would work in Munich or Vienna, you could be the pope and they would still be rude to you.

catiopatio 3y ago

I’ve never tipped 20% in places without a tipping culture, but I must admit your comment makes me think I should — at least, in the places where a tip would not be considered insulting. I tip in the US to receive better service. If it’s not considered rude to tip, and it results in better service, why wouldn’t I do that?

disruptiveink 3y ago
You won't get better service – that's my point, the next guy who sounds like you will. If people who look and speak like you tip disproportionately, everyone else that looks and speaks that way will get great service by default, even if they don't tip, at expense of everyone else now getting bad service. This of course doesn't apply if you are a regular, feel free to do whatever you want. The staff will treat you well because it's you, not because of the stereotype your accent implies.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- godelski 3y ago
  > You won't get better service – that's my point, the next guy who sounds like you will Sounds like the same thing to me. Just playing as a team instead of an individual.
mikrl 3y ago
>I tip in the US to receive better service How does this work, unless you tip before being served?

ricardobayes 3y ago

This is going like this for a long time, as a local in Eastern Europe I was sick and tired of getting a frown or a shit service, but the American couple next to me had "their feet kissed" so to say. This creates the weird duality you see on many sites that Americans are raving about eastern european places but the locals always comment "what? no, don't come here, it's crap here".